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  1. #1
    Service Manager 1,000+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.

    Synthohol's Avatar
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    there's no way its the paper.

    the proof is in the pudding ma'am.
    BH 951 finisher jams several times a week, callback ratio off the chart until i proved my point.
    WB Mason from Brazil on the left, some cheapo yellow paper i found on the shelf that was several years old in the middle and WB from Indonesia on the right.
    the halfway decent WB on the right was on the bottom of some cases for months.
    but its NEVER the paper right?20160301_095335.jpg same 3HP and corner staple.


  2. #2
    Senior member of CRS 2,500+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.

    ZOOTECH's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthohol View Post
    the proof is in the pudding ma'am.
    BH 951 finisher jams several times a week, callback ratio off the chart until i proved my point.
    WB Mason from Brazil on the left, some cheapo yellow paper i found on the shelf that was several years old in the middle and WB from Indonesia on the right.
    the halfway decent WB on the right was on the bottom of some cases for months.
    but its NEVER the paper right?20160301_095335.jpg same 3HP and corner staple.

    But, any copier should be able to feed those papers, right!

    "You can't trust your eyes, if your mind is out of focus" --

  3. #3
    Service Manager 1,000+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.

    Synthohol's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    thats right, at 95CPM that paper should flow through the machine like a river!!


  4. #4
    Retired 5,000+ Posts slimslob's Avatar
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    Post Re: there's no way its the paper.

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthohol View Post
    the proof is in the pudding ma'am.
    BH 951 finisher jams several times a week, callback ratio off the chart until i proved my point.
    WB Mason from Brazil on the left, some cheapo yellow paper i found on the shelf that was several years old in the middle and WB from Indonesia on the right.
    the halfway decent WB on the right was on the bottom of some cases for months.
    but its NEVER the paper right?20160301_095335.jpg same 3HP and corner staple.
    Paper on the right appears to have less curl hence less frequent paper jams. Could be as simple as the way the paper is loaded. You may need to take some time at the customer and using fresh packages of paper try running seam side up and seam side down. The way that has the least amount of curl is the way it should be loaded. It could also be the result of moisture if the customer is not loading full reams of paper at a time. Once the ream has been opened moisture can be absorbed by the paper. If the jamming occurs more frequently in the morning than in the afternoon, the paper could be absorbing moisture overnight. Tray heaters may need to be installed.


  5. #5
    Service Manager 1,000+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.

    Synthohol's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    oh im just poking fun of expectation vs reality when it comes to paper, after almost 18 years turning a screwdriver ive almost seen it all.
    i love this job.


  6. #6
    ALIEN OVERLORD 2,500+ Posts fixthecopier's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    I have been behind one too many techs who told the customer that it was the paper when they could have fixed something. I always tell the customer if a tech throws off on the paper, make them prove it.

    I had a call on a Minolta Di470 that wouldn't pass a single sheet. The machine was about 4 years old and had a total of about 32,000 copies on it. It belonged to the 18th Corp command. It was in what was the original base hospital, built in 1919. The building has old ventilation system that couldn't be upgraded because the building is a historical site. The command group was always deployed and never there to use it. A ream of paper could sit in the machine for a month or more and this being North Carolina, it is very humid all the time. I showed up with a ream of fresh paper. I explained all about humidity and paper and curl. I put in test mode. It jams every sheet in the fuser. I try 5 times. I remove their paper, install mine and run 50 copies without a jam. I put his paper back in, it jams every page. I put my paper back in and run 50 copies. I put his paper back in and it jams. I ask "do you understand?" he said yes. A month later, probably by the time the ream I left him had soaked up moisture, they called in another work order for jamming all the time.

    Democracy is still the worst form of government, except for all the rest of them.

  7. #7
    Service Manager 1,000+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.

    Lagonda's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    It took a while and several threats to use a electric cattle prod but we finally taught the field techs not to say "The problems your paper, now stop bothering me, but to say "The problems your paper, now lets see what we can do about it"
    Some of the better techs even keep a ream of good paper sealed in a plastic bag in their car so the can promptly demonstrate to the customer the benefits of dry paper.

    At least 50% of IT is a solution looking for a problem.

  8. #8
    Retired 5,000+ Posts slimslob's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    I remember back in he days of coated paper machines and paper pirates. We sold I think it was National Reprographics cut sheet paper and Old Town roll stock. When a customer called in with copy quality issues who had not ordered paper from us for some time, I would take a coupe of reams or rolls of fresh paper with me. I would make a copy on the paper they had, take it out and make a copy on our paper. If ours was good, I would show them the two copies and ask if they wanted to purchase some of our paper or pay to have me adjust the machine with the paper pirate paper.


  9. #9
    Master Of The Obvious 10,000+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.

    blackcat4866's Avatar
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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    It was September, a couple (decades) years ago. It had been a particularly hot and moist summer, and the elementary school was not air conditioned. The secretary tells me that some of the colored paper jams on their Mita DC-213re. Machines of that day had a completely horizontal paper path, and if there was any curl, the paper would snag on the drum claws, or the fuser inlet, and jam every time.

    Then she shows me the wall of colored paper: Eight feet high, twenty feet long, all subdivided into ream sized cubbies ... each cubby with an open partial ream of paper, all different colors, every color that you can imagine. I can't even guess how much paper that might be.

    After incubating all summer that paper was perfect ... for kindergartners to scribble pictures on, but of no use at all in the copier. If you did get 10 consecutive pages through, it was mostly blank. She was aghast when I told her that the colored paper was not useable for copies. =^..^=

    If you'd like a serious answer to your request:
    1) demonstrate that you've read the manual
    2) demonstrate that you made some attempt to fix it.
    3) if you're going to ask about jams include the jam code.
    4) if you're going to ask about an error code include the error code.


    blackcat: Master Of The Obvious =^..^=

  10. #10
    Field Supervisor 500+ Posts
    there's no way its the paper.


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    Re: there's no way its the paper.

    Blaming it on the paper is like blaming a murder on the dead guy

    Agree there are a lot of differences in quality of papers but I've never been one to blame the paper totally. Many of the old analog copiers had heaters / dehumidifiers in them, or could be installed in high humid areas so we could usually fix the curling from cheap paper. Even most of the copiers today have, or can add heaters for paper drawers.

    I've had customers near the ocean only call me in summer months, a few service calls in the summer then 8 or 9 months with no calls. Nice contract accounts. (plus get near the beach and see the bikinis )


    Still like Hammermill paper the best over staples or wb mason


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