8e versus 8 series drums

[EarthKmTech]

Anyone else noticing the 8e drums (DR314) fail around 50% life which isn't much more than the standard 100% life on the 8 series drums? (DR313K)

Seems their fancy spiral cleaning roller on the PCR isnt doing much.

[copier tech]

Anyone else noticing the 8e drums (DR314) fail around 50% life which isn't much more than the standard 100% life on the 8 series drums? (DR313K)

Seems their fancy spiral cleaning roller on the PCR isnt doing much.

Yes since the introduction of the charge roller these image units don't last as long as previous units with the corona charge.

[occus]

Anyone else noticing the 8e drums (DR314) fail around 50% life which isn't much more than the standard 100% life on the 8 series drums? (DR313K)

Seems their fancy spiral cleaning roller on the PCR isnt doing much.

That's what i expected, but until now i have not many experience.
what is the meaning of "fail"? the quality is not acceptable for foto prints or black streaks on the print? are the surfaces scratched or it is blank and only the charge roller are scratched or deformed?

I know this from kyocera printers... if the drum surfaces are ok then maybe we got the charge roller as a spare part? china/alibaba

[EarthKmTech]

This is my defnition of "Failed"

FYI, they say these drums last for 300K - I'm yet to see any changed by the customer. Like clock work around 50% the call comes in for bad print quality.



4343143432

PS. Holy crap, are we only afforded postage stamp sized attachments these days?

[tsbservice]

Have no single one, but this drum looks like shot!
PCR issue indeed.
I know you probably working for KM direct and Parts are replaced per SM and only Original toners, what they said?
Thanks for warning me on these units.

[copier tech]

This is my defnition of "Failed"

FYI, they say these drums last for 300K - I'm yet to see any changed by the customer. Like clock work around 50% the call comes in for bad print quality.



4343143432

PS. Holy crap, are we only afforded postage stamp sized attachments these days?

I have never seen one reach anywhere near 300k

From what I can tell with the charge roller running on the OPC this wears it out quicker than a corona charge which doesnt physically make contact with the drum.

[CopierNerd]

My experience is 8 series drum also fail before completing its 100% life. Drum gets scratched with toner debris but customer use it to the end and also do not complaint about it. Because those steaks don't appear or clearly visible in text.

May be i am wrong but what i diagnosed is, its due to charging roller. Whether we use OEM toner drum gets damage before life. Compatible toner destroy drum around 60 to 80K.

While 8e series drum also fails before life. I agree.

[Genotrom]

Yes, I confirm! Nobody has ever finished their life cycle. Once in a 308e I had a drum almost completely stuck with toner. All original consumables. The customer hadn't reported the problem and he liked the bad copies...

[copier tech]

My theory is the 8 series has a charge roller AND blade both putting pressure the the OPC causing wear compared to the 4 series that only has a blade causing wear on the OPC.

The OPC is the same on the 8 & 4 series.

[Zesti]

My experience is 8 series drum also fail before completing its 100% life. Drum gets scratched with toner debris but customer use it to the end and also do not complaint about it. Because those steaks don't appear or clearly visible in text.

May be i am wrong but what i diagnosed is, its due to charging roller. Whether we use OEM toner drum gets damage before life. Compatible toner destroy drum around 60 to 80K.

While 8e series drum also fails before life. I agree.

Having a same issue with 2 of the 458e's failing at around 80k. The customer got compatible toners and you confirmed the exactly what happened here.
Why KOicaMinolta shifted to Charging rollers??????

[Bix]

If you use compatible toner, the drum is known to die sooner.

[Don N.]

If you use compatible toner, the drum is known to die sooner.
Man, you guys are quick to jump on compatible toner. Not saying there isn't CRAP out there!!! BUT, so far we've seen some 8 series (C308) get about 150k before cleaning blade failure forced a change. We provided compatible toners to them ever since the first OEM tube was gone. Just seems to suggest that a good drum cylinder can survive contact with PCR's for 150k, and good compatible toner too.
Possible KM had some bad cylinders?

[Bix]

In the 8e series I have found that in addition to the drum, the fuser also lasts half its life.
Somewhere there is a pile of toner which, in addition to damaging the drum, also damages the surface of the fuser roller.
Also I only use OEM toner. So it's hard to say it's the fault of compatible toner. But if you contact KM and you try to pass the part under warranty, they only replace if you have everything OEM (it is very complicated to prove that the fault is not from the paper or something that the technician has done).

[copier tech]

Man, you guys are quick to jump on compatible toner. Not saying there isn't CRAP out there!!! BUT, so far we've seen some 8 series (C308) get about 150k before cleaning blade failure forced a change. We provided compatible toners to them ever since the first OEM tube was gone. Just seems to suggest that a good drum cylinder can survive contact with PCR's for 150k, and good compatible toner too.
Possible KM had some bad cylinders?

I'm yet to come across any 'good' compatible toner :mad:

[Don N.]

I'm yet to come across any 'good' compatible toner :mad:

My comment is based heavily on the fact that so many techs at factory auth dealers put not even the slightest weight on some customer's need for lower cost.
Not faulting the auth dealer tech at all. It's not their job...

1) The auth dealer tech has no control over buying.
2) The auth dealer tech usually just sees their oem toner vs. stuff customers buy with no knowledge of the source, like Amazon/Ebay, etc.
3) The auth dealer tech benefits from one more troubleshooting step eliminated and less possibility of a recall.
4) The auth dealer tech is using what they're given and doing what they are told to do.

Independents like me test on eagerly willing subjects like non-profits & charitables, where often we have donated the machine, our time and materials, and they appreciate that because otherwise they would just go without. We also are buying from trusted nationwide distributors that we have relationship with for decades and they have hundreds of dealers giving them feedback. We don't buy from the same sources as a rogue customer does. We can track batch numbers unlike end users. After 30 years we have struck a pretty good balance that is not easily attained in an ever changing sea of competition, and our reliance on OEM parts & supplies is about 20%. There are "good" compatible supplies out there. Perfect? Nope, but this forum is full of examples of OEM failures.

There's a line for every tech or dealership where the balance between cost and performance meets. One can go to the dance wearing clean borrowed slacks, consignment store shoes, the older brother's tie, drink the working man's brand instead of top shelf, still look good and have a great time! :cool:

[Bix]

There have always been failures, there is no perfect MFP. Indeed, one must be lucky! With OEM, you reduce the chance that the fault comes from something stupid like rotten toner.


In my experience, Konica Minolta is the company that costs slightly more but has excellent reliability. For example, if you spend $60 x original, you will only have to spend $100 for regular maintenance.


For example, if you spend $10 on a compatible toner, you run the risk of spending $300 on a new toner-damaged fuser.
(The prices are for example only, they are not real)


I tell you this because I gave out of production multifunction printers with compatible toners. I spent a lot of money only on travel for requests for intervention caused by a bad compatible toner (transfer belt motor block, toner drain clogging, dirty pages, printer to be cleaned, striped fuser, timely worn drums etc.). Being nonprofit companies, I was unable to ask for money for interventions.

[Hansoon]

My comment is based heavily on the fact that so many techs at factory auth dealers put not even the slightest weight on some customer's need for lower cost.
Not faulting the auth dealer tech at all. It's not their job...

1) The auth dealer tech has no control over buying.
2) The auth dealer tech usually just sees their oem toner vs. stuff customers buy with no knowledge of the source, like Amazon/Ebay, etc.
3) The auth dealer tech benefits from one more troubleshooting step eliminated and less possibility of a recall.
4) The auth dealer tech is using what they're given and doing what they are told to do.

Independents like me test on eagerly willing subjects like non-profits & charitables, where often we have donated the machine, our time and materials, and they appreciate that because otherwise they would just go without. We also are buying from trusted nationwide distributors that we have relationship with for decades and they have hundreds of dealers giving them feedback. We don't buy from the same sources as a rogue customer does. We can track batch numbers unlike end users. After 30 years we have struck a pretty good balance that is not easily attained in an ever changing sea of competition, and our reliance on OEM parts & supplies is about 20%. There are "good" compatible supplies out there. Perfect? Nope, but this forum is full of examples of OEM failures.

There's a line for every tech or dealership where the balance between cost and performance meets. One can go to the dance wearing clean borrowed slacks, consignment store shoes, the older brother's tie, drink the working man's brand instead of top shelf, still look good and have a great time!

HEAR! HEAR!

http://www.copytechnet.com/forums/images/smilies/cool.png

Excellent statement.
Saying this as an Indy, trying to fight costs every day......

Hans