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schmeckles22
07-13-2020, 08:41 PM
Hello,

I have posted a few times on this forum and asked similar questions but I have opted to keep the 130k milage printer and replace some of the parts (If it's what I think it is).
For a long time now prints have had dark lines down them, Its visible on light shades (graduation of colors) and a lot of my customers complain about it.

I have posted a "Peach" print as it's visible more and appears to be slightly visible on - Magenta, Cyan and Yellow prints.
Below is the graduation test / calibration pages which seem completely broken and this is after a few attempts to calibrate.

Would the problem be with the drum units or developer? I really hope it could be the drum unit - Due to COVID-19 I cannot get someone to check the printer as my city is in complete lockdown.
Worst case I will fork out £2200 for a new printer and a service contract but I like to salvage what I have right now with money being short.

Total Prints - 136,454
Dev Units all on 86%


https://i.imgur.com/xawMkeA.png

https://i.imgur.com/ZVZWWWZ.png

Phil B.
07-13-2020, 08:56 PM
Hello,

I have posted a few times on this forum and asked similar questions but I have opted to keep the 130k milage printer and replace some of the parts (If it's what I think it is).
For a long time now prints have had dark lines down them, Its visible on light shades (graduation of colors) and a lot of my customers complain about it.

I have posted a "Peach" print as it's visible more and appears to be slightly visible on - Magenta, Cyan and Yellow prints.
Below is the graduation test / calibration pages which seem completely broken and this is after a few attempts to calibrate.

Would the problem be with the drum units or developer? I really hope it could be the drum unit - Due to COVID-19 I cannot get someone to check the printer as my city is in complete lockdown.
Worst case I will fork out £2200 for a new printer and a service contract but I like to salvage what I have right now with money being short.

https://i.imgur.com/xawMkeA.png

https://i.imgur.com/ZVZWWWZ.png

of the top of my head WITHOUT knowing the model/make of the printer..... dev units.

do a full fill of each individual color and report back.

in your profile you say you have 10+ years experience .. in what brand/model?

IMHO anyone with that much time in should be able to give better information.

"Due to COVID-19 I cannot get someone to check the printer as my city is in complete lockdown." again if you are a 10yr tech why do you need someone else to come out and service your printer?

schmeckles22
07-13-2020, 09:01 PM
of the top of my head WITHOUT knowing the model/make of the printer..... dev units.

do a full fill of each individual color and report back.

Sorry! I should have mentioned - It's a C284e.
Dev units :(! Not the news I wanted to hear as they are not cheap. I have done a full fill on Cyan,Magenta and Yellow and it's difficult to see any lines, they are present but not as noticeable than the image sent above.

I corrected my profile, not sure why it mentions 10+ years, definitely not a technician that's for sure (Printers drive me nuts)

Flash
07-13-2020, 09:21 PM
Press Utility, Check consumable life and replace any items that are at end of life. Clean print head windows and rerun calibration.

schmeckles22
07-13-2020, 09:29 PM
Press Utility, Check consumable life and replace any items that are at end of life. Clean print head windows and rerun calibration.

The Drum Units show 0% but the supplier insists that they replaced the chip and when questioned he said the engineer changed a setting and this is the reason they show 0%, when setting is disabled consumable percentage will come back.

"That’s a setting on the machine in service mode so you can use the drums past the allowance, Konica restrict the drums miles before they actually need replacing so most people want to have that setting on so you can continue printing after it says the life has expired on the drum, you can’t do that if the settings off. My engineer is away this week but if you want instructions on how to turn that back on I’ll get them for you when he returns."

I am really trying to avoid buying the wrong part here as they are not cheap.

Synthohol
07-13-2020, 09:48 PM
fuck the chip and all who use them.
replace the damn worn consumables and fix the damn thing!

normally i dont get that rude and direct but im tired of seeing "I put a band-aid on a broken arm but it still hurts"
im starting to think maybe Phil has it right all along ;)

schmeckles22
07-13-2020, 09:51 PM
fuck the chip and all who use them.
replace the damn worn consumables and fix the damn thing!

normally i dont get that rude and direct but im tired of seeing "I put a band-aid on a broken arm but it still hurts"
im starting to think maybe Phil has it right all along ;)

I never did it myself, I was told it had 80% consumables on the drum units when purchased and received it with 0% and assumed they replaced the drum. I agree with your quote, I just want to determine from pictures if it's the drum units at fault or developer units.

Business has been hit hard due to the virus and my business revolves around this printer, its not used just to print a few invoices - It is my business, so I don't want to offload £700 on dev units to find it's the drums or the other way around :D

mrwho
07-13-2020, 09:51 PM
Without reading the replies and most of your post, by looking at the picture:

- Charging Units
- Drum Units
- Development Units

in this order.

Also, if the machine has it, and to minimize the problem, adjust the background voltage to either the maximum or minimum allowed (can't remember which one, I mainly do Ricoh nowadays).

schmeckles22
07-13-2020, 10:02 PM
Without reading the replies and most of your post, by looking at the picture:

- Charging Units
- Drum Units
- Development Units

in this order.

Also, if the machine has it, and to minimize the problem, adjust the background voltage to either the maximum or minimum allowed (can't remember which one, I mainly do Ricoh nowadays).

I have no idea where charging units go on a c284e, I will start with Drum units :D Wish me luck

mrwho
07-13-2020, 10:19 PM
I have no idea where charging units go on a c284e, I will start with Drum units :D Wish me luck

I believe the drum units include the chargers on those models...

Phil B.
07-13-2020, 11:32 PM
fuck the chip and all who use them.
replace the damn worn consumables and fix the damn thing!

normally i dont get that rude and direct but im tired of seeing "I put a band-aid on a broken arm but it still hurts"
im starting to think maybe Phil has it right all along ;)Thanks Brother!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

allan
07-13-2020, 11:37 PM
fuck the chip and all who use them.
replace the damn worn consumables and fix the damn thing!

normally i dont get that rude and direct but im tired of seeing "I put a band-aid on a broken arm but it still hurts"
im starting to think maybe Phil has it right all along ;)



Hehe let it rip.
Hey i do use chips by the way and fuck me for doing it.:cool:
My non contract customers has no problem with me using them to get all the value out of the parts.
Phil has the 6th sense for bullshitters the gift comes with a price.

Hey OP. Buddy do you want to fix it yourself?
If you don't like taking stuff apart there is a good chance that you will find a way to screw it up.
Have you considered hiring a tech?

Phil B.
07-13-2020, 11:43 PM
Hehe let it rip.
Hey i do use chips by the way and fuck me for doing it.:cool:
My non contract customers has no problem with me using them to get all the value out of the parts.
Phil has the 6th sense for bullshitters the gift comes with a price.

Hey OP. Buddy do you want to fix it yourself?
If you don't like taking stuff apart there is a good chance that you will find a way to screw it up.
Have you considered hiring a tech?Allan,
Thanks I guess? [emoji849]

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Synthohol
07-13-2020, 11:49 PM
I never did it myself, I was told it had 80% consumables on the drum units when purchased and received it with 0% and assumed they replaced the drum. I agree with your quote,
the person who screwed you over is whom i was addressing i guess. not you if you got stuck with a piece of bruised fruit but with that said in the long run its always better to pop in a new OEM drum and know you should get 80k+ out of it and know its not contributing to the CQ issue.

blackcat4866
07-14-2020, 12:07 AM
Before you spend a lot of money try this:
Wand the primary charge wires and laser slit glasses, then print off these images and post the results.

130K is not really a lot on the developing units. As long as you're using OEM toner they should be still serviceable.

Dirty laser slit glasses could cause a lot of your voids.
The lines seen best in orange are probably caused by the magenta drum unit.
The images you show indicate to me that you'd be best to start out with the black and magenta drums, and a gradation and stabilization.
Once you've done that much you (read: We) can diagnose it further, without spending a lot of money.
=^..^=

allan
07-14-2020, 12:25 AM
Before you spend a lot of money try this:
Wand the primary charge wires and laser slit glasses, then print off these images and post the results.

130K is not really a lot on the developing units. As long as you're using OEM toner they should be still serviceable.

Dirty laser slit glasses could cause a lot of your voids.
The lines seen best in orange are probably caused by the magenta drum unit.
The images you show indicate to me that you'd be best to start out with the black and magenta drums, and a gradation and stabilization.
Once you've done that much you (read: We) can diagnose it further, without spending a lot of money.
=^..^=


So true we are skipping the most basic of maintenance. :eek:
Good advice.

Print some half-tones and post that.

schmeckles22
07-14-2020, 12:38 AM
Hehe let it rip.
Hey i do use chips by the way and fuck me for doing it.:cool:
My non contract customers has no problem with me using them to get all the value out of the parts.
Phil has the 6th sense for bullshitters the gift comes with a price.

Hey OP. Buddy do you want to fix it yourself?
If you don't like taking stuff apart there is a good chance that you will find a way to screw it up.
Have you considered hiring a tech?

Tech is next to impossible with my city on full lockdown, all businesses closed again :( I have bought 4x black drums and CMY chips to screw onto them.


Before you spend a lot of money try this:
Wand the primary charge wires and laser slit glasses, then print off these images and post the results.

130K is not really a lot on the developing units. As long as you're using OEM toner they should be still serviceable.

Dirty laser slit glasses could cause a lot of your voids.
The lines seen best in orange are probably caused by the magenta drum unit.
The images you show indicate to me that you'd be best to start out with the black and magenta drums, and a gradation and stabilization.
Once you've done that much you (read: We) can diagnose it further, without spending a lot of money.
=^..^=

Thank you, I have done the test you've provided, the forum won't allow me to upload so I have hosted it on GDrive
SCAN20071400400.pdf - Google Drive (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KpPyU9MDE8AzcVYv9H_9Xn2q-Gc1eKSt/view?usp=sharing)
The quality is not great but you can see the lines. It's hard to see from the scans but with the black graduation I can see yellow, magenta and cyan lines mixed in with the pixels? Slightly visible on the page 7 with the black.
Please note that these were printed on round label paper so excuse the circles :D

OEM toner is being used with this printer.

blackcat4866
07-14-2020, 12:51 AM
I was wondering about the circle pattern.

Yes all the drums are bad. I never saw the point in re-chipping old drums. Start there, and the gradation and stabilization. Use good quality 96 brightness paper on you calibrations. It will make a huge difference in the results of the calibrations. =^..^=

schmeckles22
07-14-2020, 12:54 AM
I was wondering about the circle pattern.

Yes all the drums are bad. I never saw the point in re-chipping old drums. Start there, and the gradation and stabilization. Use good quality 96 brightness paper on you calibrations. It will make a huge difference in the results of the calibrations. =^..^=

Perfect! Purchased 4 black drums and the chips to put on them.
Appreciate the help and will keep the thread updated - Now to have a rant at the seller tomorrow and start the PayPal claim.

Synthohol
07-14-2020, 01:08 AM
hey, are you printing on medallion label sheets?
i see lots of circles.

Synthohol
07-14-2020, 01:10 AM
Hehe let it rip.
Hey i do use chips by the way and fuck me for doing it.:cool:

but you are not trying to mislead your customers or sell the machines as "refurbs"
big difference

allan
07-14-2020, 01:23 AM
but you are not trying to mislead your customers or sell the machines as "refurbs"
big difference

Yes very true. Doing that can only hurt your reputation.
Re-chipping the units works better than to just enable life stop.
Its good practice to remove the units to inspect and clean them. Getting the toner dusting off of the charge grids help.
Also helps to reset the aging compensation. From there increase your drum charge a bit.

For customer that sign up for high color quality they get what they pay for. Parts gets replaced at service time.
That recipe make for a very trouble free machine for sure.

The money that can be saved dealing with those troubles brings the printing cost down a bunch.

allan
07-14-2020, 01:28 AM
Yes you are on the right track.
4 x drums and remember to clean the laser glass after installing.

Its a user changeable part and replacing the chips will save you a bunch.
Somewhere you got good advise.

Bix
07-14-2020, 08:03 AM
Hi, change the drums. The replacement is not so complicated, in some cases we have it sent directly to the customer and he replaces them. On Youtube you will find tutorials.
C284e Series How To - Replace A Drum Unit - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTEu3aLVrkw)

EarthKmTech
07-16-2020, 03:41 AM
fuck the chip and all who use them.
replace the damn worn consumables and fix the damn thing!


When I worked at a tighta$$ dealer I quickly realised such devices only serve the purpose of increasing the wealth of the dealership owner. I don't like to lie to people and we were told to go around to customers who had requested imaging units etc to reset them instead. The excuses we were asked to use were outright lies and we were expected to be convincing.

And for what?

For the dealer principal to show up in a new Ferarri the week after telling us we cant afford pay rises this year.

I'm with you Synthohol.

rrrohan
07-16-2020, 05:36 AM
When I worked at a tighta$$ dealer I quickly realised such devices only serve the purpose of increasing the wealth of the dealership owner. I don't like to lie to people and we were told to go around to customers who had requested imaging units etc to reset them instead. The excuses we were asked to use were outright lies and we were expected to be convincing.

And for what?

For the dealer principal to show up in a new Ferarri the week after telling us we cant afford pay rises this year.

I'm with you Synthohol.

lucky the 8 series have a software switch to just disable the consumables screen instead.

and it wasnt a new Ferrari it was 2nd hand haha

Synthohol
07-16-2020, 03:33 PM
Just wanted to take a moment to clarify my stance on this. If you are replacing the drums with black drums and putting a new chip on it I have no problem with that only when people replace the chips to avoid replacing a worn or timed out consumable

Don N.
07-17-2020, 10:56 PM
Just wanted to take a moment to clarify my stance on this. If you are replacing the drums with black drums and putting a new chip on it I have no problem with that only when people replace the chips to avoid replacing a worn or timed out consumable

Agreed. We tried rechipping when it is fair, practical, helpful, honestly, openly done with customer informed. Problem with these 4 series is not too much after the drums are past yield they will streak and eventually pull developer, sometimes pulling enough dv out to run spiral designs, near empty mag roller until the customer reports freaky waves or tcr levels cause a code. Then you have to rescue or replace a dv unit.
Just do exactly as blackcat4866 says.
Clean laser slits and wand down the chargers. Since the drums are probably going to be replaced anyway, I have no problem telling the user to (take the drum outside in the shade) get a can of air and stick the straw in the gap between the plastic/mylar and the drum & blow off the charger screen grid under the drum to help clean the charger where the wand wont. It will help reduce maybe 50% or more of those lines. It will buy you some time but best to buy the 4k oem drums and chip cmy. RE-clean the laser slits underneath after any drum install. Instant success. DV's should be good for a lot longer.

BTW, KM has riveted the K chip on now, so careful removing the rivet. If you cut off the top, the rivet shaft will fall into the charger and cause hell. Best to get a 100 watt solder gun, touch the rivet for just a few seconds and lift the chip with a flat blade screwdriver. The rivet will melt its way out the top. Smear enough plastic back into the hole to screw in your new chip, or get the right size screw to do so. You can use the old drum's charge cover screws. they are perfect. Some people double stick tape the chips down.

Keep yer powder (& paper) dry!

schmeckles22
07-19-2020, 10:19 PM
Second post(Replied to the wrong thread first)

Thank you for to all those that helped! All units have been replaced, rechipped from black unit and everything is spot on.
AMAZING! Not felt this happy for a long while.

Apart from a burnt finger from my solder iron, everything went smoothly.
I will be donating to the forum at the end of the month when my salary hits.

blackcat4866
07-19-2020, 11:25 PM
You'll get used to the burns from the soldering iron. You don't even feel them after a while.

Congratulations on your success. =^..^=

mga
07-20-2020, 06:43 PM
fuck the chip and all who use them.
replace the damn worn consumables and fix the damn thing!

normally i dont get that rude and direct but im tired of seeing "I put a band-aid on a broken arm but it still hurts"
im starting to think maybe Phil has it right all along ;)

Well said totally agree stop wasting your time just replace parts needed drums are the most important for copy quality problems and cleaning laser glass

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