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orestesp
02-24-2021, 05:25 PM
Hello,

I just finished repairing the LU-202 that came with our machine. It was broken when we got it, and I thought by sharing my experience repairing it hopefully you can avoid the mistakes I did while trying to get everything working.

First of all, I am not a technician, I just maintain my machines following the manual and by sometimes consulting the experts on this forum. With that out of the way:

When I first opened the unit up, it looked like a bomb had gone off; All of the wires were unusable in some way; some had broken while others had their plastic lining roughened up or peeled off. While most of the pulleys and structural elements of the lift plate were bent or otherwise deformed. I have no idea what the previous owners did to the unit, but it looked like the KM tech maintaining the machine had bend some things back into place (evident by the grip marks made by a pair of pliers) but obviously that didn't hold.

As it turned out, you can't bend them back into place. Almost all the parts in this unit are made from some soft aluminum alloy. I replaced all of the bent pulley shafts, but didn't replace the front bar on the lift plate that the two front pulleys attach onto. This was a mistake, as it easily bent back into its original deformed shape, after me making a mistake while putting the lift wires in their correct positions.

Honestly, if a unit with a problem like mine comes your way, replace everything that has been damaged or deformed in any way. It is not worth the risk. The whole lift mechanism is flimsy and very difficult to repair. It took me 2-3 hours on the 2nd try to disassemble and reassemble everything. I don't know why KM went with this design instead of using something more solid like e.g. leadscrews with a timing belt.

I had a hard time understanding the manual on this one, so here is a quick summary of what you need to do. This is not meant to substitute the instructions provided by the manual, it's just to (hopefully) make your life a bit easier understanding it.

• Start by doing one side first, it can be either the drive or the operator side. Install the lift wires from the one sitting most inner to the axle to the one sitting most outer to the axle. On the final one, do not try to pass the wire from all its pulleys and then trying to attach the spring to the body of the unit. Instead, leave the wire off the 2nd to last pulley, install the spring, and then attach the wire to that pulley.
• Repeat roughly the same procedure for the other side.
• Test if everything works! It is very easy to get something wrong, trust me! Using something like a small Allen wrench, rotate the drive shaft, while having another person on the other side tell you if everything works as it should. Be very careful. If one of the tension springs start to deform (it shouldn't), stop immediately and check, most likely you have wound a wire the wrong way. Lift the plate fully up and fully down a couple of times to make sure it works reliably.
• Re install the gear box bearing in mind that you have to align the big central black gear with the positioning sensors before putting on the last gear.

Finally, using a spirit level, push the feed mechanism down and jig the door so the lift plate lifts to the upmost position and perform the paper lift horizontal adjustment so the unit feeds paper reliably. Mine worked reliably after performing this adjustment.

I am also attaching pictures of the unit with the wires in their correct positions, since the pictures found on the manual weren't very helpful for me. Hopefully you find this useful.

4841548416484174841848419

Regards,
Orestes.

blackcat4866
02-24-2021, 11:59 PM
This isn't an easy operation. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Congratulations on your success! =^..^=

allan
02-25-2021, 12:18 AM
Good job on that.
It gets in that state because of a dirty photo interrupter sensor, the one that detects the top of the stack so that the lift plate will stop lifting. If its not working then the plate will just continue lifting until it destroys itself. Wish they included a cut off switch or a torque limiter of some sort.

I scrapped the last LU that did that.

rrrohan
02-25-2021, 05:10 AM
Why did you accept delivery of a faulty unit?

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

orestesp
02-25-2021, 08:00 AM
Good job on that.
It gets in that state because of a dirty photo interrupter sensor, the one that detects the top of the stack so that the lift plate will stop lifting. If its not working then the plate will just continue lifting until it destroys itself. Wish they included a cut off switch or a torque limiter of some sort.

I scrapped the last LU that did that.I do not think that this is the case, though I could be wrong (is there a 2nd photo interrupter sensor apart from the one on the bottom on the drive side?). When I initially jiged the door, the lift plate came all the way up, and when it realized that it couldn't go any further up, the machine threw a code. Unfortunately, I didn't note down which one, but when I tried it the second time, I also held down the feed mechanism and the lifting stopped once the lift plate triggered the mechanical remaining paper sensor.

Sent from my Redmi Note 5 using Tapatalk

orestesp
02-25-2021, 08:01 AM
Why did you accept delivery of a faulty unit?

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using TapatalkI bought the machine 2nd hand from a local listing, not from a dealer.

Sent from my Redmi Note 5 using Tapatalk

orestesp
03-22-2021, 10:07 PM
Hello everyone,

I have so far fed a couple of thousands of sheets of both uncoated and coated stock of varying weights with great success using this unit.

However, for some reason unbeknownst to me, when I want to print duplex on 300 gsm paper (well, 2 x simplex to be precise), after printing on one side of the sheet, and reloading the paper in the LCT, it just won't feed. Not a single sheet. It happens on both uncoated and coated stock (300 gsm). I tried adjusting the feed pressure using the spring but that didn't help at all. The sheet isn't picked up by the feed roller at all.

According to the machine counter, the rollers are brand new (less than 6k). Has anyone come across this before? Anything I should try?

Thanks.

48680

blackcat4866
03-22-2021, 10:44 PM
It's the downward curl that is preventing pickup. You'll need to find a way to reverse the curl: weight the stack overnight, manually reversing the curl, ... whatever. the media must be flat to feed.
=^..^=

BillyCarpenter
03-22-2021, 11:02 PM
It's the downward curl that is preventing pickup. You'll need to find a way to reverse the curl: weight the stack overnight, manually reversing the curl, ... whatever. the media must be flat to feed.
=^..^=


Makes perfect sense to me. Good stuff.

orestesp
03-22-2021, 11:18 PM
It's the downward curl that is preventing pickup. You'll need to find a way to reverse the curl: weight the stack overnight, manually reversing the curl, ... whatever. the media must be flat to feed.
=^..^=

That's a bummer. Just out of curiosity: Why is this tray so sensitive to this while the bypass tray doesn't seem to care at all?

BillyCarpenter
03-22-2021, 11:20 PM
That's a bummer. Just out of curiosity: Why is this tray so sensitive to this while the bypass tray doesn't seem to care at all?



Just out of curiosity, what is the max weight for paper for the LCT vs bypass?

blackcat4866
03-22-2021, 11:25 PM
It's a completely different feed system. and yes, downward curl will cause jamming from any/all trays.

Yes, it's 300gsm maximum. Glossy stock less. =^..^=

BillyCarpenter
03-22-2021, 11:34 PM
It's a completely different feed system. and yes, downward curl will cause jamming from any/all trays.

Yes, it's 300gsm maximum. Glossy stock less. =^..^=


Correct me if I'm off base. The downward curl creates air between the sheets of paper. The more sheets of paper, the more air pockets you're gonna have and the paper will give way when the pick up roller drops down and that's what causing the jams??

blackcat4866
03-22-2021, 11:53 PM
Correct me if I'm off base. The downward curl creates air between the sheets of paper. The more sheets of paper, the more air pockets you're gonna have and the paper will give way when the pick up roller drops down and that's what causing the jams??

Yes ... and, since the stack height at the pickup tire is higher than it should be due to the curl, the leading edge is below the paper outlet, feeding the paper into the left edge of the tray, instead of feeding it into the bite of the rollers.

Upward curl is OK. Downward curl just doesn't work. And 300gsm really holds the curl.
Excellent! =^..^=

BillyCarpenter
03-23-2021, 12:08 AM
Yes ... and, since the stack height at the pickup tire is higher than it should be due to the curl, the leading edge is below the paper outlet, feeding the paper into the left edge of the tray, instead of feeding it into the bite of the rollers.

Upward curl is OK. Downward curl just doesn't work. And 300gsm really holds the curl.
Excellent! =^..^=


I didn't think about the height of the stack...though I should have. Good stuff once again.

raplma
03-23-2021, 12:00 PM
Hi Orestes
Good to see you around.
We run a lot of heavy stock and indeed know your scenario, and the causes are exactly what has already been said.
One thing to try - other than manual decurling - is to change the 'Output Delivery' selection to face up, rather than face down, we find that with some stocks changing the way they go through the exit rollers can effect curl, especially NCR on these machines.
When we got the c7000 which comes with the relay unit/de-curler it made a massive difference. There is a relay unit for your machine RU-504 although it may simply cool rather than decurl, they are very slim units, so won't add much to the overall length of the machine, the fun will be finding one!
See you around
Mark

P.S. respect for re-wiring your LU-202!

allan
03-23-2021, 10:53 PM
Good thread.

Some real good suggestions. Would never have thought of printing face up but the curl would be in the same direction?. Only advise i can add is to make sure the pickup solenoid is adjusted properly and that there is adequate weight added to the front of the pickup assembly, there are a couple of weight supplied with the machine and the LU.

That is where the PRESS machines are better than the PRO machines. You can adjust the curl a fair amount on the B1250.


I missed what model of machine this LU is attached to.

orestesp
03-24-2021, 09:34 AM
Hi Orestes
Good to see you around.
We run a lot of heavy stock and indeed know your scenario, and the causes are exactly what has already been said.
One thing to try - other than manual decurling - is to change the 'Output Delivery' selection to face up, rather than face down, we find that with some stocks changing the way they go through the exit rollers can effect curl, especially NCR on these machines.
When we got the c7000 which comes with the relay unit/de-curler it made a massive difference. There is a relay unit for your machine RU-504 although it may simply cool rather than decurl, they are very slim units, so won't add much to the overall length of the machine, the fun will be finding one!
See you around
Mark

P.S. respect for re-wiring your LU-202!

Hello,

Unfortunately, I already run all of my jobs face up - mainly because I need to monitor the output of the engine and because I recently discovered that my decurling roller is shot (I need to get around replacing that) and that causes problems with thinner stock.

Unfortunately the RU-504 isn't compatible with my finisher, but even if it was, it's almost impossible to find one domestically. You can't even find a used production digital press for sale in places like local listings, let alone a random finishing module.


Good thread.

Some real good suggestions. Would never have thought of printing face up but the curl would be in the same direction?. Only advise i can add is to make sure the pickup solenoid is adjusted properly and that there is adequate weight added to the front of the pickup assembly, there are a couple of weight supplied with the machine and the LU.

That is where the PRESS machines are better than the PRO machines. You can adjust the curl a fair amount on the B1250.


I missed what model of machine this LU is attached to.

I thought about doing the last two adjustments that are outlined in the service manual, but it was feeding everything I threw at it perfectly and I didn't want to cause any possible additional problems. In the bypass tray, the pick up roller is weighted down by the 2 weights you mentioned, maybe that's what makes the difference?

It's a C6500.

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