texchar555
10-04-2010, 03:27 AM
Is anyone going for the BIZHUB 8000 class in here?
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HORSE
10-04-2010, 04:29 AM
What you mean Press C8000 training? Already did it and now have the T-shirt.
Stirton.M
10-04-2010, 09:56 AM
I'm still waiting for them to send me so I can get the t-shirt too....:p
Seems nobody is buying in our area, which will be the only reason I would see a course any time soon...I know our trainers are trained....
Seems nobody is buying in our area, which will be the only reason I would see a course any time soon...I know our trainers are trained....
texchar555
10-04-2010, 04:18 PM
How was the class and where did you go?
Stirton.M
10-04-2010, 07:57 PM
Well, it seems I am going fairly soon, though I have no dates yet. Just waiting for the paperwork to be completed on Corp side and off to Toronto, the middle of the world, I go.
texchar555
10-05-2010, 04:59 AM
Im going to Chicago soon hopefully on the 19th of this month and then the 6000/7000 on the 25.
Stirton.M
10-05-2010, 08:18 AM
I have tentative dates...29th November through to Dec 3 I think....or is it longer, I cannot recall...the boss is working out the details. I had a choice of around the beginning of November too, but I liked the other date better. I can book an extra week after and count that as my holidays for Christmas.
I forgot about the 6000/7000 series. I suspect that is in my future too.
Have fun on your course.
I forgot about the 6000/7000 series. I suspect that is in my future too.
Have fun on your course.
jma676
10-05-2010, 05:01 PM
*******While waiting, here you can review some points of this new system!******
Features of bizhub PRESS C8000 | New Konica Minolta Digital Press (http://stopthepresses-km.com/features/)
Features of bizhub PRESS C8000 | New Konica Minolta Digital Press (http://stopthepresses-km.com/features/)
Stirton.M
10-06-2010, 12:15 AM
Dates set in stone. My supervisor gets the beginning of Nov, I get the end...
As for waiting jma, I have downloaded the manuals a week ago...got all the meat right there...
As for waiting jma, I have downloaded the manuals a week ago...got all the meat right there...
racefreak
10-06-2010, 03:30 AM
Went to the pre release class in CT back in June. Good class and great machine. A few small things need to be addressed but a major leap forward.
texchar555
11-01-2010, 10:31 PM
Well, My class starts on Nov 8th and I can't wait to start class. Hope to see some you guys in class.
Stirton.M
11-02-2010, 12:46 AM
My course has been moved to the mid week in December...could not book me in the earlier classes. A co-worker is doing his course supposedly next week, but that has been postponed due to lack of having a machine to do the training on in Toronto. This does not bode well that we cannot even get a training machine....heh
kingpd@businessprints.net
11-02-2010, 12:50 AM
I'll only get to go if NEC works out a deal with Konica Minolta...so far they haven't.
texchar555
11-09-2010, 12:50 PM
today is the day I will be taking pics of this machine. I will post after class today.
AyJayAreDii
11-09-2010, 06:42 PM
First I have herd about this machine. looks like Konica is matching the Ricoh ProC900. So is it a new engine or just a beefed up c6500?
texchar555
11-09-2010, 11:17 PM
70897088708770867085well I got some pics for ya let me know if you like more pics.7084
Stirton.M
11-09-2010, 11:32 PM
First I have herd about this machine. looks like Konica is matching the Ricoh ProC900. So is it a new engine or just a beefed up c6500?
Mostly new engine. A lot of design improvements. It is a competitor to offset press' out there...1200x1200 dpi, two fusing units....air fed...bunch of finishing options...
There are also press 6000 and press 7000 machines that are directly based on the 6500 chassis but again, hi res....meant to succeed the 5500/6500 legacy...
Mostly new engine. A lot of design improvements. It is a competitor to offset press' out there...1200x1200 dpi, two fusing units....air fed...bunch of finishing options...
There are also press 6000 and press 7000 machines that are directly based on the 6500 chassis but again, hi res....meant to succeed the 5500/6500 legacy...
kingpd@businessprints.net
11-10-2010, 05:05 AM
70897088708770867085well I got some pics for ya let me know if you like more pics.7084
Everything looks rather neat and compact inside. Is it a very straight paper path? I can't really tell.
Everything looks rather neat and compact inside. Is it a very straight paper path? I can't really tell.
xcopy
11-10-2010, 06:39 AM
I heard it was over engineered. I mean why have two fuser units thats twice the work and twice the cost.
texchar555
11-10-2010, 11:26 PM
paper path is pretty straight. It dosent have a decurler section after the fuser section. Pm so far is units beside the ef-101 unit 2nd fuser unit, its belts that you have to replace and as far as replacing them its not hard at all.
mgutski
12-01-2010, 10:34 PM
went to the class early November, training in Chicago. nice machine. dont have any in my area yet. as far as the press 6000 and 7000, if you are c6500 trained once you pass the c8000 class you can become certified on them through online training..
Stirton.M
12-02-2010, 12:33 AM
I heard it was over engineered. I mean why have two fuser units thats twice the work and twice the cost.
Actually, after day 3 of the course, I now know why and how the 2nd fuser works with the main,
The main body fuser is greatly improved over the older one. The mechanics of it are far easier to work with and involve fewer parts on the drive side. Some improvements include a polishing roller that purportedly polishes the upper fusing roller to eliminate the marks seen from wear marks left behind on thick paper stock...for example, letter size paper leaves wear marks on the surface, printing at larger paper sizes, those wear marks are seen as dull areas in solids on the larger stock. The polish process is supposed to eliminate this.
The second fuser's purpose is to give gloss to the finished document on certain heavy paper stocks. Lighter stock will bypass the unit. It is contained in an external option to the very left of the main body, and though it is an "option", it is a mandatory option. The fuser also moves back and forth inside the unit, reducing the wear marks. This unit has two belts of identical nature, instead of a belt and roller, similar to the C6500 series. The main fuser has a large fuser roller with two belts on either side. The upper belt is there to help maintain heat while in idle, the lower belt provides the nip, which is also extended from roughly 1/4 inch (10mm) to 30mm, or just slightly over 1 inch. Maintenance on both fusers is extremely easy, especially the main fuser. Maintenance time roughly 45 minutes at current estimate...both belts are complete units, so simply replace the unit, minus the lamps, along with the main fuser roller and yer done.
The second fuser, because it is not always used, service intervals are greatly extended.
Both units are ORU (operator replaceable units)...simply stated, the operator will replace the unit as needed...we rebuild the used unit and leave it as a spare for the user. Several other items, like the transfer belt unit, developer units, and drum units and charge wires, are also ORU...all use resettable RFI tags to reset the counters on those items.
There are many many other wows in this machine...
texchar555
The decurler is in the RU-508 unit, the other mandatory option that attaches to the left of the EF-101 (second fuser). That unit also contains the humidifier option. Additional finish options like perfect bind, saddle stitch and fold and so on attach there.
Some other cool features....2 paper feed units (PF-704) can be ganged together to allow 6 drawers of large format, high capacity paper to feed up to 350 GSM paper stocks, all air fed to the main body. There is an optional document feeder/scanner PF unit (PF-705) that can be used in place of one PF-704. These units do not have to have a second unit attached.
8 laser beams per print head unit, allowing 1200 DPI per colour. An additional colour registration sensor and an additional density sensor are also included to improve reproduction. Drum units are slightly larger as well.
Thus far I am completely impressed with the mechanics of the machine and some of the small improvements. The the RU-508, decurler/humidifier section is the cats meow....this unit includes colour density sensors to ensure colour accuracy feedback to the machine AFTER the job has been through the fusers. The machine will periodically send a patch page through for the sensors to measure on the fly, maintaining colour balance without user intervention.
Actually, after day 3 of the course, I now know why and how the 2nd fuser works with the main,
The main body fuser is greatly improved over the older one. The mechanics of it are far easier to work with and involve fewer parts on the drive side. Some improvements include a polishing roller that purportedly polishes the upper fusing roller to eliminate the marks seen from wear marks left behind on thick paper stock...for example, letter size paper leaves wear marks on the surface, printing at larger paper sizes, those wear marks are seen as dull areas in solids on the larger stock. The polish process is supposed to eliminate this.
The second fuser's purpose is to give gloss to the finished document on certain heavy paper stocks. Lighter stock will bypass the unit. It is contained in an external option to the very left of the main body, and though it is an "option", it is a mandatory option. The fuser also moves back and forth inside the unit, reducing the wear marks. This unit has two belts of identical nature, instead of a belt and roller, similar to the C6500 series. The main fuser has a large fuser roller with two belts on either side. The upper belt is there to help maintain heat while in idle, the lower belt provides the nip, which is also extended from roughly 1/4 inch (10mm) to 30mm, or just slightly over 1 inch. Maintenance on both fusers is extremely easy, especially the main fuser. Maintenance time roughly 45 minutes at current estimate...both belts are complete units, so simply replace the unit, minus the lamps, along with the main fuser roller and yer done.
The second fuser, because it is not always used, service intervals are greatly extended.
Both units are ORU (operator replaceable units)...simply stated, the operator will replace the unit as needed...we rebuild the used unit and leave it as a spare for the user. Several other items, like the transfer belt unit, developer units, and drum units and charge wires, are also ORU...all use resettable RFI tags to reset the counters on those items.
There are many many other wows in this machine...
texchar555
The decurler is in the RU-508 unit, the other mandatory option that attaches to the left of the EF-101 (second fuser). That unit also contains the humidifier option. Additional finish options like perfect bind, saddle stitch and fold and so on attach there.
Some other cool features....2 paper feed units (PF-704) can be ganged together to allow 6 drawers of large format, high capacity paper to feed up to 350 GSM paper stocks, all air fed to the main body. There is an optional document feeder/scanner PF unit (PF-705) that can be used in place of one PF-704. These units do not have to have a second unit attached.
8 laser beams per print head unit, allowing 1200 DPI per colour. An additional colour registration sensor and an additional density sensor are also included to improve reproduction. Drum units are slightly larger as well.
Thus far I am completely impressed with the mechanics of the machine and some of the small improvements. The the RU-508, decurler/humidifier section is the cats meow....this unit includes colour density sensors to ensure colour accuracy feedback to the machine AFTER the job has been through the fusers. The machine will periodically send a patch page through for the sensors to measure on the fly, maintaining colour balance without user intervention.
kingpd@businessprints.net
12-02-2010, 01:16 AM
That sounds pretty cool Stirton. Is the glossy effect from the second fuser just from the passing of the paper itself or does the second fuser actually apply some sort of coating or chemical to the paper?
Stirton.M
12-02-2010, 02:20 AM
It is the passing of the paper through it...this is the description in the training wbt....
Duplex fusing is performed for a second time (2nd Fusing) on paper
which has already been fused at the 1st Fusing in the Main Body, this
will help to achieve a Natural Gloss that is close to that of Offset Printing
and improve Gloss Evenness.
I didn't describe this 2nd fuser very well...
If you are familiar with the C6500 fuser, the upper fuser consisted of a fusing belt wrapped around a large roller (heat lamps inside) and a smaller sponge roller. The smaller roller is pressed against the lower fusing roller to create the fusing nip at the time of paper passage, other times, the lower roller and belt are separated.
On the C8000, there is no lower roller, just an inverted duplicate of the upper belt arrangement. Basically two spongy rollers are pressed against each other (two belts pressed against each other actually, the rollers are inside the belts)....
Not much else to them, aside from drive motors, an assortment of temperature sensors and 6 lamps.
I have yet to see the benefit of this in action, but hopefully by the end of this week, I will have been able to test print beyond internal prints.
Some other cool features....
paper skew registration correction....two rollers directly driven by two separate motors steer the paper according to two pairs of optical sensors, the first sensors send a signal to the motors to straighten out the paper as much as they can, the second will sense if there is any prevailing skew present and if so, will forward the motors a little more at the same time causing a loop to the registration roller. Basically the paper will be square to the transfer process.
The second transfer roller on the ADU, used to be a rubber-ish roller. Now it is a transparent belt wrapped around two metal rollers.
Another cool feature is that the transfer belts themselves have drift correction...a set of sensors sense the side position of the belts and if the belt drifts to the front or rear of the unit, a tension roller is either tightened or loosened within the belt via a motor/gear/lever assembly that causes the belt to shift in the opposite direction as it rolls. Older generations, C500, 8050 and C6500 series belt units were all susceptible to drifting....various causes to this, not common, but it could happen.
Duplex fusing is performed for a second time (2nd Fusing) on paper
which has already been fused at the 1st Fusing in the Main Body, this
will help to achieve a Natural Gloss that is close to that of Offset Printing
and improve Gloss Evenness.
I didn't describe this 2nd fuser very well...
If you are familiar with the C6500 fuser, the upper fuser consisted of a fusing belt wrapped around a large roller (heat lamps inside) and a smaller sponge roller. The smaller roller is pressed against the lower fusing roller to create the fusing nip at the time of paper passage, other times, the lower roller and belt are separated.
On the C8000, there is no lower roller, just an inverted duplicate of the upper belt arrangement. Basically two spongy rollers are pressed against each other (two belts pressed against each other actually, the rollers are inside the belts)....
Not much else to them, aside from drive motors, an assortment of temperature sensors and 6 lamps.
I have yet to see the benefit of this in action, but hopefully by the end of this week, I will have been able to test print beyond internal prints.
Some other cool features....
paper skew registration correction....two rollers directly driven by two separate motors steer the paper according to two pairs of optical sensors, the first sensors send a signal to the motors to straighten out the paper as much as they can, the second will sense if there is any prevailing skew present and if so, will forward the motors a little more at the same time causing a loop to the registration roller. Basically the paper will be square to the transfer process.
The second transfer roller on the ADU, used to be a rubber-ish roller. Now it is a transparent belt wrapped around two metal rollers.
Another cool feature is that the transfer belts themselves have drift correction...a set of sensors sense the side position of the belts and if the belt drifts to the front or rear of the unit, a tension roller is either tightened or loosened within the belt via a motor/gear/lever assembly that causes the belt to shift in the opposite direction as it rolls. Older generations, C500, 8050 and C6500 series belt units were all susceptible to drifting....various causes to this, not common, but it could happen.
HORSE
12-02-2010, 02:27 AM
That sounds pretty cool Stirton. Is the glossy effect from the second fuser just from the passing of the paper itself or does the second fuser actually apply some sort of coating or chemical to the paper?
No the paper just goes through a second fusing process which gives it the shine, Stirton what do you think of the 2nd Transfer belt unit? I hope your trainer apologized in advance.
No the paper just goes through a second fusing process which gives it the shine, Stirton what do you think of the 2nd Transfer belt unit? I hope your trainer apologized in advance.
Stirton.M
12-02-2010, 02:39 AM
It has its benefits and of course, drawbacks too I suppose...the drawback being that it is not easy to replace that belt....it is REALLY easy to take the unit off the ADU, but not so easy to remove and replace the belt item itself, even after it is out of the machine. And of course, having to take great care not to touch the surface of it....I think it could become a problem in the field, pending the type of users who may own the machine....
I suppose that since it is an ORU unit, that is some consolation.
As for the instructor, he's "learning" about some of these things along with us. We're the pilot course in Canada on this machine.
I suppose that since it is an ORU unit, that is some consolation.
As for the instructor, he's "learning" about some of these things along with us. We're the pilot course in Canada on this machine.
HORSE
12-02-2010, 02:47 AM
It has its benefits and of course, drawbacks too I suppose...the drawback being that it is not easy to replace that belt....it is REALLY easy to take the unit off the ADU, but not so easy to remove and replace the belt item itself, even after it is out of the machine. And of course, having to take great care not to touch the surface of it....I think it could become a problem in the field, pending the type of users who may own the machine....
I suppose that since it is an ORU unit, that is some consolation.
As for the instructor, he's "learning" about some of these things along with us. We're the pilot course in Canada on this machine.
Its easy to take the unit out but the belt is a c**t, I did a 1/2 PM a few weeks ago on our showroom machine and have a few installs over the next few weeks.
I did my training in August, have you got your bizhub PRESS polo shirt yet? or do you have to wait to Friday for that?
I must post pictures of it sometime.
I suppose that since it is an ORU unit, that is some consolation.
As for the instructor, he's "learning" about some of these things along with us. We're the pilot course in Canada on this machine.
Its easy to take the unit out but the belt is a c**t, I did a 1/2 PM a few weeks ago on our showroom machine and have a few installs over the next few weeks.
I did my training in August, have you got your bizhub PRESS polo shirt yet? or do you have to wait to Friday for that?
I must post pictures of it sometime.
Stirton.M
12-02-2010, 02:58 AM
Come to think of it, there was no mention of the shirt thus far...I'll be sure to make a stink about it tomorrow....
There is some talk at my shop that the sales reps don't want to push this machine...too expensive according to them...I think I heard 3 are sold in Toronto already, with more on the way.
I've been taking lots of pics of the assorted areas we looked at, lots of images of things opened up and so forth...mostly for the benefit of those sales reps, so they can see just how superior this machine is relative to the 6500s....I am reserving judgment on the 7000, as I understand it is a beefed up 6500....lasers the prime difference if I understood what I heard, same DPI as the 8000.
There is some talk at my shop that the sales reps don't want to push this machine...too expensive according to them...I think I heard 3 are sold in Toronto already, with more on the way.
I've been taking lots of pics of the assorted areas we looked at, lots of images of things opened up and so forth...mostly for the benefit of those sales reps, so they can see just how superior this machine is relative to the 6500s....I am reserving judgment on the 7000, as I understand it is a beefed up 6500....lasers the prime difference if I understood what I heard, same DPI as the 8000.
kingpd@businessprints.net
12-02-2010, 03:15 AM
Its easy to take the unit out but the belt is a c**t, I did a 1/2 PM a few weeks ago on our showroom machine and have a few installs over the next few weeks.
I did my training in August, have you got your bizhub PRESS polo shirt yet? or do you have to wait to Friday for that?
I must post pictures of it sometime.
awe man, i'd like a bizhub polo shirt. we never get any good stuff from NEC. we can get nec branded items but we have to pay for them.
I did my training in August, have you got your bizhub PRESS polo shirt yet? or do you have to wait to Friday for that?
I must post pictures of it sometime.
awe man, i'd like a bizhub polo shirt. we never get any good stuff from NEC. we can get nec branded items but we have to pay for them.
texchar555
12-03-2010, 12:47 AM
yes they are the sames 8 bit
texchar555
12-03-2010, 12:56 AM
hey stirton, who do you have as the instructor? I had Charvey, I really like the guy but when it come to grading not so much. I missed 1 q and got a 93. 15 q's only but also troubleshooting and practical. he only graded the 15 question written.
Stirton.M
12-03-2010, 01:01 AM
A fellow by the name of Dave Rooney...I am being trained in Mississauga (Toronto)....one more day to go....
My guess is I did well, but I will not know the full details until a week from now...likely when I am out of retaliation range of him....heh
He's pretty cool...cracks a lot of jokes....
My guess is I did well, but I will not know the full details until a week from now...likely when I am out of retaliation range of him....heh
He's pretty cool...cracks a lot of jokes....
jma676
12-07-2010, 01:28 AM
70897088708770867085well I got some pics for ya let me know if you like more pics.7084
Thanks for the pictures, I saw the Bizhub C8000 Press last month in the ExpograficaArgentina, I collect information of this new system prior to this event so it was a past juicy with some colleagues, in this moment I am not working directly with the Representative Konica Minolta in Argentina, but I hope maybe it Establish some sort of agreement to work together, because we've already worked together through a contractor to buy equipment as C550/C451, C6500/C6501 and also I was the first installer and maintain the Bizhub C6500 in the Country.
Thanks for the pictures, I saw the Bizhub C8000 Press last month in the ExpograficaArgentina, I collect information of this new system prior to this event so it was a past juicy with some colleagues, in this moment I am not working directly with the Representative Konica Minolta in Argentina, but I hope maybe it Establish some sort of agreement to work together, because we've already worked together through a contractor to buy equipment as C550/C451, C6500/C6501 and also I was the first installer and maintain the Bizhub C6500 in the Country.
mondo59
12-08-2010, 02:51 AM
Went to the pre release class in CT back in June. Good class and great machine. A few small things need to be addressed but a major leap forward.
Have you setup a C8000 yet? and if so how do does the test pattern #53 look like 100 value of BK?
Have you setup a C8000 yet? and if so how do does the test pattern #53 look like 100 value of BK?
Duppsko
12-08-2010, 10:24 AM
Hi
I've installed one system, and I'm not impressed with the coverage of the test pattern#53 with 100%black. I've done the same tests on both C6500 and C7000 and they are much better. Even when they not are newly served.
The 8000 also had problems with keeping the same denisty in a series of 50ex.
I've did the same test after I've changed starter, drum and charge but with same result.
Does anyone else have the same problem?
I've installed one system, and I'm not impressed with the coverage of the test pattern#53 with 100%black. I've done the same tests on both C6500 and C7000 and they are much better. Even when they not are newly served.
The 8000 also had problems with keeping the same denisty in a series of 50ex.
I've did the same test after I've changed starter, drum and charge but with same result.
Does anyone else have the same problem?
HORSE
12-14-2010, 11:03 AM
Pictures of new shirts as promised.
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