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scomeau1
03-07-2012, 11:52 PM
I'm looking to buy a color copier in the 50 PPM range and can't make mine mind up to go with KM C552 OR Xerox 550 ?

Can anyone please give me your views on how well the KM is to Xerox.

Also how are there repairing and parts cost ?

Thank you for Help!

Scott

EarthKmTech
03-08-2012, 10:03 AM
either one on a contract will be fine, unlike the 1 eyed xerox drones, I'll quite happily suggest that they are reasonable machines having worked on them in the past. I have always and still do prefer working on KM's though.

Flash
03-09-2012, 12:06 AM
I work on both. KonicaMinolta all day long. The FS526 does slow the C552 down a little if you are doing booklets. It only has one booklet stapler whereas the C550 had 2. The copy quality is better on the C552.

scomeau1
03-09-2012, 12:41 AM
I work on both. KonicaMinolta all day long. The FS526 does slow the C552 down a little if you are doing booklets. It only has one booklet stapler whereas the C550 had 2. The copy quality is better on the C552.

So you like the KM C552 better than the Xerox 550 ??

Do you think the KM C552 takes less time to work on than Xerox 550.

How about the drums Xerox are user replaceable and KM are not ?

What about repair parts are KM Parts cheaper than Xerox ?

Thanks for any help you can give Sir !

Scott

rockin57rod
03-09-2012, 03:53 PM
I work on Xerox...they are boring....very few service calls.....your better to get one of those machines where you can see the Tech everyday....LOL

scomeau1
03-09-2012, 11:05 PM
I work on Xerox...they are boring....very few service calls.....your better to get one of those machines where you can see the Tech everyday....LOL

So I guess that your saying hear is KM has a lot more service needed than Xerox ?

Thanks !

rockin57rod
03-09-2012, 11:32 PM
So I guess that your saying hear is KM has a lot more service needed than Xerox ?

Thanks !

That may be one interpretation of my humble opinion....I can say that they also have a lot of "components" ....for example the fuser assembly that can be easily changed by the user....and that is fantastic if you run different size stocks.....I know printers that still use Xerox machines that were built ten years ago....they just seem to think and design beyond the "office copier" mentality...

scomeau1
03-10-2012, 12:52 AM
That may be one interpretation of my humble opinion....I can say that they also have a lot of "components" ....for example the fuser assembly that can be easily changed by the user....and that is fantastic if you run different size stocks.....I know printers that still use Xerox machines that were built ten years ago....they just seem to think and design beyond the "office copier" mentality...

I agree with you as I realy like that the Xerox fuser and drum can be changed my the user. I was looking at the KM C552 and I'm not sure I like the paper route compared to the Xerox.

I'll rather buy a Xerox but I'm looking at a used 700 with 142K on it but there are asking 22K for it. Lot's of money !

Thanks for your input sir.

Scott

Coptech
03-11-2012, 03:16 AM
That may be one interpretation of my humble opinion....I can say that they also have a lot of "components" ....for example the fuser assembly that can be easily changed by the user....and that is fantastic if you run different size stocks.....I know printers that still use Xerox machines that were built ten years ago....they just seem to think and design beyond the "office copier" mentality...

No offense, but since you brought it up, do you get a much cheaper service contract rate since they expect the customer to do all of the service on their own machine?

Also, glass half full, glass half empty on the engineering design, but I always thought it was a little moronic to expect a secretary to exchange a fusing unit that nearly matched her body weight.:confused:

rockin57rod
03-11-2012, 03:30 AM
I would be offended if I had to call a tech in to change my heat rollers everytime I ran different jobs on different size stock....If your in the print business....being able to change your fuser...so you can have different fuser's for different stock sizes is a brilliant idea....it goes all the way back to the minolta 520/530/530R if you have been in this business for 30+ years....and if you work on production equipment...operators change fuser components.....all the time.

now if you work for an office printer company.....that's a different story.....maybe you can add toner for them when your there.............

Coptech
03-11-2012, 03:45 AM
I would be offended if I had to call a tech in to change my heat rollers everytime I ran different jobs on different size stock....If your in the print business....being able to change your fuser...so you can have different fuser's for different stock sizes is a brilliant idea....it goes all the way back to the minolta 520/530/530R if you have been in this business for 30+ years....and if you work on production equipment...operators change fuser components.....all the time.

now if you work for an office printer company.....that's a different story.....maybe you can add toner for them when your there.............


We are equal on years in the business. I don't work on KM anymore but recently retired an 8050 from a print shop that had almost 10M color prints on it. I understand your comments about the fuser cahnges for different size papers. The fuser swap is a band-aid fix and KM made customer swappable fusers in later machines for that reason. In my mind it was a logistical problem in that their PM cycle (weak as it was at 100K) had fuser rebuild stuff in it. So which fuser gets the PM parts? the one that ran 30K or do you change the other early? or do you wait for an off cycle failure? From what I have seen since, other manufacturers just made fusers that are not prone to the paper edge dulling of the fusing rollers. Oh well, as you mentioned, a production print is a different animal but unfortunately, production print is only part of the market.

Maybe the approach of spending an hour on hold trying to place a service call while some mindless twit reads a help screen and starts suggesting to the customer which parts they might try changing is progress. We had an air force base that took the big X clear out of the bidding process because of that very reason.

Just my opinion. I am sure it is worthless to you. That too puts us on equal ground in another area.

Bottom line, I don't care which machine he decides to buy. I would go with whoever gives the best service in your particular area. All things considered, if one company was head and shoulders better than the rest, there would only be one company in business.

rockin57rod
03-11-2012, 03:52 PM
Your opinion is not worthless to me...I find it sexist and bias....but of value...and if you have been doing office service for 30+ years that may explain it.

I do however "care" about what someone buys....and agree service is everything....so I pity the poor tech that is trying to get some junk printer to duplex 10pt stock, running full bleed....like the guy said in Saving Private Ryan...."just give me a friggin chance....and thats why I offer my opinion....even if others don't value it.

Mother X builds the best box I have ever seen (machines running 1.5 BILLION).....it's just too bad they make so many pin head moves when dealing with their customers...but then I don't work for Mother X...I work for me.

enough said...and we should not hijack this post to chat about it....


We are equal on years in the business. I don't work on KM anymore but recently retired an 8050 from a print shop that had almost 10M color prints on it. I understand your comments about the fuser cahnges for different size papers. The fuser swap is a band-aid fix and KM made customer swappable fusers in later machines for that reason. In my mind it was a logistical problem in that their PM cycle (weak as it was at 100K) had fuser rebuild stuff in it. So which fuser gets the PM parts? the one that ran 30K or do you change the other early? or do you wait for an off cycle failure? From what I have seen since, other manufacturers just made fusers that are not prone to the paper edge dulling of the fusing rollers. Oh well, as you mentioned, a production print is a different animal but unfortunately, production print is only part of the market.

Maybe the approach of spending an hour on hold trying to place a service call while some mindless twit reads a help screen and starts suggesting to the customer which parts they might try changing is progress. We had an air force base that took the big X clear out of the bidding process because of that very reason.

Just my opinion. I am sure it is worthless to you. That too puts us on equal ground in another area.

Bottom line, I don't care which machine he decides to buy. I would go with whoever gives the best service in your particular area. All things considered, if one company was head and shoulders better than the rest, there would only be one company in business.

Coptech
03-11-2012, 04:29 PM
I guess I see where you can dig "sexist and bias" out of my comments. I did comment on the secretary doing the work. Over the years, I have been in enough law offices to notice that it is not the attornies that get stuck with the trench work. More than once have I seen them standing in front of the copier with a blank stare until one of his secretaries comes to rescue him.

Anyway, in my youth, I was convinced that the brand I was working on was the best in the world and all others were insignificant. My age taught me that you could take the machines that I held close to my heart, and put them in a different market with a less caring dealer, and all of a sudden, they were the crap machines. That is why my advice was to find the brand that has that "dedicated" tech support in your given area, and use their ambition and determination to your advantage. After all, it is not always book knowlege that makes the better tech, but the willingness to "dig in" and keep fighting when others are ready to give up.

You are right in that "Mother X's" Achilles heel is in their decision process. The corporate 800 number to place a service call manned by someone reading a decision tree, in my opinion is not the sound approach. But this is from an outsider's viewpoint. Oh well, that one is not my battle.

I too, apologize for the thread hijack but in reality, we gave some good advice along with the "behind the scenes" info. I still stand by my opinion of finding the best servicing dealer in your area and following their advice.

rockin57rod
03-11-2012, 05:35 PM
agreed

EarthKmTech
03-11-2012, 11:35 PM
I work on Xerox...they are boring....very few service calls.....your better to get one of those machines where you can see the Tech everyday....LOL

my experience is a few years old now, but,

the paper trays and paper feed system on xerox machines is bullet proof in my experience. You dont generally get calls for "paper jams" unless its because those ultra expensive short living click on click off paper feed rollers need to be changed. The rollers may last longer on the KM's but theyre a pain in the ass to change in comparison, the trays are rubbish and the paper feed system is very susceptable to the most minor issues with the paper. Build quality on the xerox machines is generally alot better.

parts are alot more expensive on the xerox machines, user interface less user friendly along with the driver. technician consumable replacements on the xerox's were much more involving, time consuming and alot more annoying on the xerox machines. They are decent machines but as with all brands, they are not perfect - and as technicians do we want them to be ? We'd be the first people looking for employment if they were....

fixthecopier
03-12-2012, 10:40 PM
You should poll for best service. I love to walk in and see a Xerox box. Why? Because I end up selling them a Konica. I have nothing bad to say about the Quality of a Xerox, but the parts are high. I replace them because customers do not like the company. High pressure in this area. I also hear techs complain about working for them, and an unhappy tech is not the one you want working on your machine.

rockin57rod
03-12-2012, 11:53 PM
Well service is everything...thats why they pay the big buck...with all the big perks....LOL
And its funny that I experience the complete opposite of what you do...........
Must be the weather...

kingpd@businessprints.net
03-27-2012, 09:53 AM
If you're not doing your own service then I really think either choice will be fine.

Personally, I would probably go with Konica Minolta in this case:

1. Probably more service options (many dealers in network vs. mostly xerox direct)
2. More competition on parts and supplies if necessary
3. I always liked their color much better
4. Xerox tends to be more monopolistic and proprietary...only wanting you to buy from with increased costs
5. Service response time is most likely quicker at an independent dealer

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