Ethical Service Call question for techs & everyone basically

[someguy]

Hello all new to the forum I had a question I wanted to ask its more like an ethical question thanks to anybody that reads & responds. Basically this is the situation,

About 3 months ago I purchased a printer and it arrived damaged, since I had gotten it for a reasonable price I decided to have a tech come out and look at it before I returned it to see if it would better to fix or send back. When the technician came by he did inspect it and took a look at it and his final verdict was that he would call me back later with a list of parts and or procedures that he would need to do to the machine.

He never called me back, I ended up calling the company back 2 times that week and their response was that the tech was out on the field but he would call me back as soon as he got back to the office. Still did not get a response.

Later that week I ended up purchasing a new machine and its been up and running since but now the printer company that had the tech come by wants to charge me for the service call. I told them I felt no service had been performed since no resolution was done, the tech couldve just as well sat in the parking lot or stared at the machine for 2 hours and I wouldve gotten the same outcome.

Their argument is that since the tech was still on site for 2 hours I am still responsible for payment and this is where the dilema is.

For any service techs that go to businesses, in this particular scenario how do you all see it? Ive asked to speak to the owner of the business and to the tech himself but still havent received calls from them.

Also, keep in mind i had been a customer of this particular business for about 4 years. I had a printer I had purchased from a customer of theirs and their printing rates got transferred to me, I had previously been with them for maybe 4 years or so paying only printing fees (about $170 - $200 month) (no leasing equipment or any other fees) and it wasnt until their printer ran out of juice and they told me they couldnt fix it anymore and I would have to purchase a new printer which I ended up doing on my own for around $1500 less than what they were offering me for the same model.

The new printer I purchased on my own was the one that arrived damaged.

Also, since I had not been paying for leasing or equipment (again just for printing) they had already come by several times int he past wanting me to upgrade printer and always saying the model I have would not be supported due to parts running out so its been a while that they were wanting to me to upgrade, which i did except not thru them. I always felt they were kinda pressuring me due to they were only making money on the pages printed rather than on equipment leasing fees or rental fees.

Thanks to all who respond!

[kingarthur]

if your printer arrived damaged, why didn't you get in touch with the people who supplied it, it was their problem, not yours, if you called out a tech to examine your printer.....then yes...you are liable to pay for his time....but, i would suggest maybe you could ask them come to some sort of arrangement to get the bill reduced....

[copyguy1]

Since the tech came to your location to look at the printer you didn't buy from them you should have to pay for an estimate at least. But it should never take 2 hours. You may want to look for somebody else to work on it in the future. Good luck

[ZOOTECH]

Since the tech came to your location to look at the printer you didn't buy from them you should have to pay for an estimate at least. But it should never take 2 hours. You may want to look for somebody else to work on it in the future. Good luck

I'm with you on the 2 hr inspection/estimate, but did he ever get an estimate, it doesn't sound like it from his post?

[someguy]

I'm with you on the 2 hr inspection/estimate, but did he ever get an estimate, it doesn't sound like it from his post?

thanks to all and to answer no he did not give me any kind of estimate or quote of any kind, the final response was "ill look it up and get back to you" and i never heard from him again

And also, the printer was damaged and I was given the option to return it, but since I had originally gotten it for a good price I decided to weigth the cost between getting it fixed or returning it, the parts in the machine such as fuser unit & photoconducter units and whatever other expendable parts just themselves were worth more than what I paid for the entire unit.

[nmfaxman]

If they don't have a signed estimate or service ticket, you don't owe anything.

[blackcat4866]

Hmmmmmmmm! Interesting one. I think I would have handled it a little differently.

First thing, is I would have informed you that dropped printers are very expensive to fix, and frequently exceed the cost of replacement. Second, I would have made sure you knew the estimate was billable, whether the machine is fixed or not. Third, I would have advised you at the 1 hour mark that you were at $150.00. Do you want me to continue with the estimate? Or maybe I would be done, I don't know. Fourth, I would have followed up within two days with a completed estimate or at least an email that I was working on it. Fifth, I would have had a salesman present the estimate comparing the cost of repair with the cost of a new replacement.

So the service man blew it in several ways. 1) He did not inform you that dropped printers are rarely cost effective to fix. 2) He did not tell you that you would owe for an estimate regardless. 3) He should have given you a status report at one hour. 4) He did not provide the final estimate.

My first impression is that you owe, excepting that you never got the estimate. I think I would approach the service manager with the following deal:
Choice 1) Provide a completed estimate for 1 hour labor cost. You did not approve more.
Choice 2) Don't provide the estimate and owe nothing.

Does that seem fair? =^..^=

[someguy]

ok thanks to everyone im still waiting on them to call me back so ill see how to approach it i got a better insight after reading everyones posts here thanks again have a great day

[mojorolla]

If they don't have a signed estimate or service ticket, you don't owe anything.

Agreed. If you did not sign anything, how can they prove the tech was even there? And 2 hours is way too long for an inspection.
As a tech, my first natural thought is a fee should be levied. However, if you did not sign anything, you never agreed to a charge in writing.


:)

[someguy]

Agreed. If you did not sign anything, how can they prove the tech was even there? And 2 hours is way too log for an inspection.
As a tech, my first natural thought is a fee should be levied. However, if you did not sign anything, you never agreed to a charge in writing.


:)

ok just so you all know they sent a rep over and i explained what happened and to sum it up they agreed with me the tech hadnt completed the service call the way he shouldve also the tech himself admitted he failed to call us back and followup, i told them this should be an issue between the manager and the tech for not doing his job.

The offered to lower the cost by half but I still declined, Its not that I didnt want to pay, its the principle, weve spent well over $8k with this company thruout the years, I also manage a small business so if i make a mistake I hold myself accountable and well its too bad i guess but anyways thanks to all that replied and gave me you alls point of view.

[pepper38_cnd]

Someguy, You are the customer that every Dealer dreads! You’ve been a customer for a long time and we want to keep you. But you have no loyalty and after you get a quote from us, you purchase the same equipment from somebody else. Somebody else who offers no support, no installation, no qualified technician, he may not even have a shop or any overhead ! And because doesn’t have to offer you any of this, he can offer to sell to you at a much lower price than us!

So your bargain doesn’t work and you call us. We send out a Tech, he does whatever it is and says he’ll get back to you. But because he is so busy looking after customers who actually bought from us, your quote gets put on the back burner or in this case forgotten about. (Not a good thing no doubt, but shit happens. I am not condoning this.)

Now the ethical question: Does someone who places a service call, on equipment they did not purchase from the Service Provider have an obligation to pay for the Technicians time spent regardless of the out come?

Keep this in mind the cost of a Tech includes:

-Service Vehicle Costs
-Vehicle inventory
-Liability insurance
-Dispatch costs including elaborate service record keeping
-Tech Training
-Tech Wages
-Health Benefits
-Parts inventory and warehousing
-Tools and communications

I’m sure there are many service related costs that Dealer incur that I haven’t mentioned.
But the point is “It costs money to send a Technician to your office” The days of “Free Estimates” are mostly gone, unless those terms are prearranged with management, and it doesn’t sound like that happened.

I agree with most others. That this Tech did a poor job. But he is not charging you for a repair, only for an estimate. I believe most estimates are 60% of the minimum 1 hr charge, and are to be completed in 30 minutes or less, if you go ahead with the repair that fee is rolled into the total labor charge. That’s what I believe you should be charged 60% of a 1 hr charge..

[just a tech]

Hello Someguy..

After reading everyone's posts, I'd have to say that some very good points were brought up by both sides of the argument.. Here is my input :

YES, the service provider should have handled things way different than they have..

They should have informed you that the call was billable during your initial phone call when you originally placed the call for service and BEFORE the tech came out..
The technician should have never taken 2 hrs to assess a copier.. 1 hr is more than sufficient to assess damage on most machines..
The technician should have gotten back to you with your estimate for repair promptly..(regardless if you are a "usual customer" or not.. You are a PAYING customer)
The company should not have just blown you off as if you were a nuisance..
Once your problem was conveyed to the company, the Service Manager of the company should have contacted you to resolve your issue as quickly as possible..
The technician should have had a detailed workorder filled out and ready for you to read and sign after his work was completed..


As some of my colleagues here have previously stated.. It is costly to operate a service dept. As the Service Manager for my company, I can tell you that the last time I calculated my department's burden rate, we were sitting at around 72.00 per service call taken, on average.. Meaning that it costs the company approx. 72.00 every time I send one of my guys on a service call.. And that's per hour.. Not just 72.00 flate rate.. (this is including their drive time as well) So, as you can see.. The costs can add up quickly..


What do I think you should do..? I think you should request a meeting with that company's Service Manager and go over your concerns one item at a time..

If it were one of my techs that screwed up, the first thing I would do is :

Offer my apologies to you for the consistant lack of attention your needs have recieved..
I would show up with your "estimate for repairs" in hand and I'd go over your options concerning the potential repair of said equipment..
Once the options had been laid out, I would reduce your bill to only 1 hr of labor as I feel that is a proper amount of time to evaluate a piece of equipment..
Then, after going over your estimate for repairs.. I would have you sign a workorder stating that your machine had been assessed and your estimate explained..
If you chose to have us perform the repairs, the cost of assessment would be wiped off and you'd only owe for the labor/parts required (and approved) by you..
If you did not chose to have us perform the repairs, then you would be liable for the cost of 1 hr labor for the assessment..


Bottom Line -- If I were you.. I would not pay for the service call until I recieved my estimate for repairs.. But once I had my estimate, I would pay for the service call..
Think about it like this.. If you take your vehicle, that's out of warranty, to the dealership for an estimate to repair your knocking engine and they inspect and diagnose your vehicle.. After they get with you and explain the costs associated with your repairs, you go to the counter and pay up.. You don't expect them to inspect and diagnose your vehicle for free.. Same difference.. Once ya have your estimate, pay em.. But not before..


Take Care,
J_T

[JR2ALTA]

You should not pay anything.

Why?

He didn't say the evaluation was chargeable.

How can you charge someone a rate, any rate, that wasn't agreed on?


Many, many business still do free estimates.



The company should eat the cost and learn a lesson not to be lazy, vague, bumbling morons.

[someguy]

Someguy, You are the customer that every Dealer dreads! You’ve been a customer for a long time and we want to keep you. But you have no loyalty and after you get a quote from us, you purchase the same equipment from somebody else. Somebody else who offers no support, no installation, no qualified technician, he may not even have a shop or any overhead ! And because doesn’t have to offer you any of this, he can offer to sell to you at a much lower price than us!

So your bargain doesn’t work and you call us. We send out a Tech, he does whatever it is and says he’ll get back to you. But because he is so busy looking after customers who actually bought from us, your quote gets put on the back burner or in this case forgotten about. (Not a good thing no doubt, but shit happens. I am not condoning this.)

Now the ethical question: Does someone who places a service call, on equipment they did not purchase from the Service Provider have an obligation to pay for the Technicians time spent regardless of the out come?

Keep this in mind the cost of a Tech includes:

-Service Vehicle Costs
-Vehicle inventory
-Liability insurance
-Dispatch costs including elaborate service record keeping
-Tech Training
-Tech Wages
-Health Benefits
-Parts inventory and warehousing
-Tools and communications

I’m sure there are many service related costs that Dealer incur that I haven’t mentioned.
But the point is “It costs money to send a Technician to your office” The days of “Free Estimates” are mostly gone, unless those terms are prearranged with management, and it doesn’t sound like that happened.

I agree with most others. That this Tech did a poor job. But he is not charging you for a repair, only for an estimate. I believe most estimates are 60% of the minimum 1 hr charge, and are to be completed in 30 minutes or less, if you go ahead with the repair that fee is rolled into the total labor charge. That’s what I believe you should be charged 60% of a 1 hr charge..

The thing is there was never an estimate he never called me back, he never even told me they could or couldnt service the machine, just "ok ill get back to you, and well actually the thing is I did try to stay with them, the machine I had for around 5 years I got transffered from a previous customer of theirs that sold it to me, so their service contract was transferred to me. Since I had purchased the machine from a customer, they were not making money with any leasing fees just for the prints I was doing, which was around $200 or so a month again for around 5 years . When it finally broke down and they told me they couldnt fix it and the only way was for me to upgrade or lease (even though I did offer to purchase whatever parts i needed on my own), Thats when I purchased another printer on my own from newegg.com ( i didnt purchase from another local dealer). Keep in mind that same printer i was offered for over 1k more with the same dealer, and before I purchased on my own I did tell them if they could match the price I would get it thru them but they declined.

So I basically saved 1k by buying on my own, next, I looked into getting a service contract with teh same company to service it and pay per print, however after doing the math I realized I was actually paying 2 x's as much for printing than I could on my own. Basically, the toner I got for around $600 total should last between 8 - 11+ months if I keep printing waht I was printing before on average, and again with that company I was payinb about $200 a month.

Now, i understand business is business, and i am a believer in keeping even whatever small business i could give them locally, however if this wouldnt of happened I wouldve never looked into how much I could save by just getting everything on my own, now, i know some parts are expensive and any future tech calls as well, however if I did the math I would say I would still be more cost effective to own the printer and pay for any service calls on my own than what i would be paying on a per month basis like I was doing before.

Now with this tech that came out, I already knew him, the tech and the company already was kinda hassling me to upgrade the machine from already before, I really dont know why he didnt finish the service call, even their own rep said he admitted to not following up with me and basically left me hanging, I would put it along the lines as ordering a pizza, the delivery guy comes and wants to charge but he didnt deliver the pizza, although they put it in the oven and had it ready he just didnt deliver it he forgot it and wants to hold me responsible for it.

i also work for a small business so i hold myself accountable if i do something wrong so I know how it is, and actaully, I would say I would probably be a very good customer, before I purchased on my own I told them I was going to compare around, I gave them the opportunity to match the deal, I had already been loyal to them for a few years and paid all my dues, in fact I had even given their techs some gift certificates for my business in the past just for coming out and servicing that same day, even though that was included in my contract.

I was looking forward to keeping the same contract for my new machine until all this happened. When I was looking into upgrading the machine I even flat out told the salesperson they sent that whatever business I can give them will be for the service contract and not for leasing or purchasing the machine as I was going to compare and see for myself what the best price for me is for equipment,Since i manage a small business the name of the game is saving money as well. I am planning on keeping and using this machine till whatever 5 - 10+ years it lasts so it wouldnt make sense for me to lease or do a long term payment plan. It kinda seem like they wanted to make a quick buck off a long term customer.

[Masterchief]

If you chose to have us perform the repairs, the cost of assessment would be wiped off and you'd only owe for the labor/parts required (and approved) by you..
If you did not chose to have us perform the repairs, then you would be liable for the cost of 1 hr labor for the assessment..
J_T




This is great advice, You had a techy service a printer for 2 hours or so, which i find hard to believe as a printer should take at most an hour to determine the problem.

I just hope it is a printer we are talking about, can you post the model for correct service times.

The technician called, as you said and if he did arse about for 2 hours the service manager will know the most service time allowed for the size printer. If it is 1 hour max then this tecky got a right ear bashing i can assure you of this along with a host of questions etc regarding the service on your machine.
either way you are in a good posistion here and may not loose out in the end if you follow the post

If you chose to have us (the Company) perform the repairs, the cost of assessment would be wiped off and you'd only owe for the labor/parts required (and approved) by you..

If you did not chose to have us perform the repairs, then you would be liable for the cost of 1 hr labor for the assessment.

Find out the cost of 1 hour labour and if the parts required are a little bit more then it wiill be money well spent to be honest.

Since the printer is still Brand new, then when it is repaired you can keep it or Sell it making a few quid more

Masterchief