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westvandude
12-11-2013, 04:53 PM
So yesterday we were running real low on toner.... in our C550. We still had some supplies of C353 toner left from our previously leased machine from KM.

I'm on my first load of non-oem toner from www.aaatoner.com (http://www.aaatoner.com) (stuff works fantastic same quality no issues BTW!) and asked Bobby from AAA if I could use the C353 toner in the C550.... he said if it's OEM then yes. So I poured the C353 yellow out into the empty yellow bottle (from what we got from him and refilled our C550 cartridge. Then poured the bottle contents into our C550 toner (with the machine saying 20% toner left). Shook it up. Slapped it in.

Works perfect!!

So the motto of the story is, if you have upgraded to a C550 from a C353 you can use those colour toners in an emergency situation no issues. In our case the new toner supplies are being shipped but I was getting close to running out of toner printing a big job. Saved my butt! :D

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The only issue is if your toner cartridge chip says you have zero toner left and you run the cartridge out you can't refill it.... so refill when around 20% left. Chip will eventually tell printer no toner left but auger system will indicate toner so you can likely run it for a while like that.

Synaux
12-11-2013, 10:52 PM
Glad to hear that worked for you.

FYI: If I recall correctly, the toner for the c451 (assuming the c450 is a typo) is not compatible with the c550/650.

Also, there is a special firmware/software switch that squelch the IU/Toner out of life messages and allow for continued operation (although if the toner cartridge is fully exhausted you are looking at potentially more work than simply replacing the cartridge). :cool:

westvandude
12-12-2013, 01:19 AM
I think it's just the latest firmware that doesn't stop the machine if your IU is end of life.

Not sure that allows you to keep printing if toner runs out. The chip shows how many pages are left but I'm told the sensor in the IU detects if toner actually runs out and stops the machine. Don't quote me on that one tho.

KM did that to save money! This way they don't have to replace an IU on your machine until you see your image quality sucks!! Most customers don't care too much or don't notice so big time savings for them.

wseyller
12-12-2013, 03:59 AM
So you did this yesterday? So you think that one day is enough to believe that it was a fantastic choice that you used toner originated for another device. Not saying you made a bad choice as for all I know it may work out just fine. One day isn't going to tell you anything. There could possibly be consequences that may take its told on not just image units but possibly even other components such as the fuser. It is possible that it could severely shorten the life of other components and cost you more in labor and parts in the end. I wish you good luck. Hopefully someone one who has had experience with the same experiment can give you some relief.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk

westvandude
12-12-2013, 04:31 AM
Well... I'm not saying it's the best idea. Typically you know within a few pages if you made a big mistake or not as every machine is tuned for a particular toner type. I did ask the aftermarket toner manufacturer for advice before doing it.

Occasionally someone's a guinea pig. :) If nobody every tries something different we'll never know.

Same thing for OE vs aftermarket toner. Why spend 2-3X the cost. So far on the aaatoner there is absolutely no difference in print quality. Why line someone else's pockets?

We do tons of cosmetic product labels on polyester stock so the transfer belts never last as long as stated anyway.

Synaux
12-12-2013, 07:20 AM
I think it's just the latest firmware that doesn't stop the machine if your IU is end of life.

Not sure that allows you to keep printing if toner runs out. The chip shows how many pages are left but I'm told the sensor in the IU detects if toner actually runs out and stops the machine. Don't quote me on that one tho.

KM did that to save money! This way they don't have to replace an IU on your machine until you see your image quality sucks!! Most customers don't care too much or don't notice so big time savings for them.

To my knowledge, it is definitely not a base firmware (or the latest--regarding the c451-650 models). It is a special firmware (e.g., C650_A00H0Y0-F000-GS6-R6) and it requires someone that understands the world of binary (and Konica's understanding of it at that) to set the software switch (51) to accomplish this.

I avoid third party/questionable toner as it simply leaves me with another question when diagnosing--especially concerning quality--that goes something like this:
Well...perhaps its that toner and if it is, how far has it affected other components? Which leads to several imponderables that are simply not worth my time, when avoidable.

While I have not experienced it directly, K toner will damage other IUs exposed to it, but I have had this type of contamination recently in a machine that was addressed relatively quickly. Point is, I doubt that nearly identical toners will exhibit issues immediately, which renders it more of a long term issue (if at all). Either way, I am still concerned about that particular machine after much more than a few pages....
Perhaps the toner you used it identical though.

I will say, that like most consumables, if I were to take samples and juxtapose various products with my microscope and chemistry set I have doubts that I would find noticeable differences in the toners of like models.

pepper38_cnd
12-12-2013, 01:01 PM
So yesterday we were running real low on toner.... in our C550. We still had some supplies of C353 toner left from our previously leased machine from KM.

I'm on my first load of non-oem toner from www.aaatoner.com (http://www.aaatoner.com) (stuff works fantastic same quality no issues BTW!) and asked Bobby from AAA if I could use the C353 toner in the C550.... he said if it's OEM then yes. So I poured the C353 yellow out into the empty yellow bottle (from what we got from him and refilled our C550 cartridge. Then poured the bottle contents into our C550 toner (with the machine saying 20% toner left). Shook it up. Slapped it in.

Works perfect!!

So the motto of the story is, if you have upgraded to a C550 from a C353 you can use those colour toners in an emergency situation no issues. In our case the new toner supplies are being shipped but I was getting close to running out of toner printing a big job. Saved my butt! :D

-----------------------------
The only issue is if your toner cartridge chip says you have zero toner left and you run the cartridge out you can't refill it.... so refill when around 20% left. Chip will eventually tell printer no toner left but auger system will indicate toner so you can likely run it for a while like that.

Fantastic! You say? I may be old school but I imagine at least 90% of techs who have been around for more than a couple years are cringing and possibly laughing under their breath as they read your post. Three months from now when the dev in the IU is stripped and toner is bleeding from every crevice of the machine the $20 you saved on toner will seem trivial.

folukems
12-25-2013, 05:48 PM
Fantastic! You say? I may be old school but I imagine at least 90% of techs who have been around for more than a couple years are cringing and possibly laughing under their breath as they read your post. Three months from now when the dev in the IU is stripped and toner is bleeding from every crevice of the machine the $20 you saved on toner will seem trivial.

I have used more than 5 sets of Bizhub c7000 toners for c353 and c 451/550/650/652 it works perfectly without any hitches . The print quality is superb do nt tried it on c364

jotunn
12-27-2013, 09:26 AM
Don't post such things in public area...

That's already known facts for those people who can understand MSDS data. But making them public (available for indexing engines of Google, Bing and so on) is ultra irresponsible.

Please remove whole thread.

Motormount
01-07-2014, 11:45 PM
I think it's just the latest firmware that doesn't stop the machine if your IU is end of life.

Not sure that allows you to keep printing if toner runs out. The chip shows how many pages are left but I'm told the sensor in the IU detects if toner actually runs out and stops the machine. Don't quote me on that one tho.

KM did that to save money! This way they don't have to replace an IU on your machine until you see your image quality sucks!! Most customers don't care too much or don't notice so big time savings for them.

KM will happily replace your IUs... with a bill, since you just voided any warranty or maintenance agreement. Do you think they are saving money by not selling IUs to their dealers?
In my 30+ years experience in the industry, yes, some non-OEM toners seem to work, but usually with drawbacks - low yield, pre-mature failure of other parts/supplies, etc. Watch for your IUs to fail (cleaning blade), the waste toner bottle to fill faster, fuser rollers to fail, and a filthy machine... how much did you say you were saving? Get the end users thinking "all toner is the same" and try troubleshooting the results, particularly if they don't own up to it.

westvandude
04-15-2014, 01:22 AM
Wow... lots of haters here. You know... in a completely out of toner situation when you just NEED to finish that last print job you'll experiment.

Anyway, the C353 toner makes the yellow a bit dull vs OE shiny. That's about it.

I'm not on a service contract, I'm my own tech on my C550. BTW, been running aftermarket toners from aaatoner.com since we got the machine last November. The only problem is I've saved a ton of money. Since November I've saved $4000. The machine only cost me $1500. So I'm way ahead.

Buying parts from KM is a total waste of time... I just tried and they couldn't even tell me an IU was available anywhere in western Canada. What a joke and then they quote me something like $1200 list price on a C552 IU (wrong one doesn't fit in mine anyway) but that's a joke.

I got all 4 new IU's for $1300 delivered!!! From a US supplier, brand new OEM in the original sealed boxes. I will NEVER order parts from KM direct. They are complete douchbags.

To each their own.

Hansoon
04-15-2014, 05:16 AM
Anyway, the C353 toner makes the yellow a bit dull vs OE shiny. That's about it.

That's typically the effect of all aftermarket toners I had to use in the past. Another problem often faced with aftermarket toner is that with one component toner the black bleeds into yellow giving it a soiled look.

Hans

westvandude
04-15-2014, 05:29 AM
Oh, sorry, you misunderstood.... what I originally did was on our C550 we had a big print job and we ran out of toner. I had a bunch of OEM C353 toner lying around so I emptied the C353 toner cartridge into the C550 cartridge. Worked just fine. That was just the yellow. But I noticed it was slightly less shiny on the yellow prints than before. Other than that it worked fine. The yellow IU did give out a bit sooner than the others but I always expect that due to the fact yellow is the predominant colour in all our print jobs. So as a % coverage it's almost double the other colours.


That's typically the effect of all aftermarket toners I had to use in the past. Another problem often faced with aftermarket toner is that with one component toner the black bleeds into yellow giving it a soiled look.

Hans

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