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  1. #11
    RTFM!! 2,500+ Posts allan's Avatar
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by blackcat4866 View Post
    I can't pass the opportunity to disagree with these fine folks.

    I NEVER damage the shaft further. Most of the time cleaning and adding light oil make the one-way bearings work properly. If it still slips the bearing and/or the shaft must be replaced. Damaging the shaft further will not restore the shaft to it's original size and condition. =^..^=

    Yes that will be affordable to do but the shaft only in my experience. Don't get it often that a clutch will fail before 250K. Found that my method works ok.

    Those one way clutches last forever.
    Whatever

  2. #12
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by blackcat4866 View Post
    I can't pass the opportunity to disagree with these fine folks.

    I NEVER damage the shaft further. Most of the time cleaning and adding light oil make the one-way bearings work properly. If it still slips the bearing and/or the shaft must be replaced. Damaging the shaft further will not restore the shaft to it's original size and condition. =^..^=
    I agree I never would damage the shaft. As long as there are no circular grooves worn in the shaft I would just clean it and apply one small drop of oil where the bearings ride is all that is needed. If the shaft shows wear (grooves felt with a fingernail) I would replace it but this takes 400-500 thousand copies with normal wear. You can use a scotch bright as a last resort but only in the rotating direction. Then come back later to replace the shaft. I always replace the one way clutches when ever I replace a roller and I hardly ever have jamming calls.

  3. #13
    Certified Konica Expert 2,500+ Posts
    Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    The following is my personal POV and experience and in no way is intended to cause controversy with conflicting views from other members

    Scuffing the shafts where the bearing ride is done the same direction as the shift from end to end.
    Use a 3m scotch Brite or emery cloth just enough to get rid of the mirror finish.
    I have never in 23 years heard of using oil on them as the last thing I want is lubrication where I need good grip by the needle bearings.
    I don't understand why a lubricant is needed for grip. I scuff the shafts, soak the one-ways in IPA and clean with a rag and a blast with a can of air to dry.
    Unless the shaft is worn enough that there is a noticeable 'divots where the bearings ride the method I use has worked literally thousands of times.
    Scuffing the burnished shaft in the same direction the rollers turn also does not make sense to me as that will cause the needles to only ride the high spots of the surface instead of better lateral contact.

    All you can do is listen to all the advices offered and make up your mind which way to go.
    Trial and error will help you form a routine to handle procedures like this.

    Short 'for instance'...

    I recently watched another tech starting to remove a fuser to replace a t-belt on a 4 series. I laughed out loud. He said it's the only way the belt will come out. I then showed him the 1 stupid screw on the upper guide plate on the t-belt. Removed guide and now the belt comes in and out without obstruction or extra work removing the fuser.

    Now it's the only way he does it.
    But he had to perform it both ways and made his decision to try it the less laborious way and it all worked out
    Good luck and happy trials
    We know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two.
    Also don't ask me for files without a contributor badge.

  4. #14
    RTFM!! 2,500+ Posts allan's Avatar
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthohol View Post

    I don't understand why a lubricant is needed for grip. I scuff the shafts, soak the one-ways in IPA and clean with a rag and a blast with a can of air to dry.

    The springs that push the needle bearings out can get sticky. Paper dust i guess. Using IPA or even WD-40 flushes out the muck buildup in there. Also will not use oil in there but get away using WD-40.

    Like my method cutting grooves into the shaft bumps the needle bearings and the springs making sure they don't get stuck over time.

    One of the manager i worked under insited that i use spray oil on the magnetic clutches!! Tries it on a Ricoh 3025. Instant regret. Fixed it buy soaking them in IPA.

    Watched a guy using yellow toner to prime out of the box color IU's....
    Whatever

  5. #15
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by Synthohol View Post
    The following is my personal POV and experience and in no way is intended to cause controversy with conflicting views from other members

    Scuffing the shafts where the bearing ride is done the same direction as the shift from end to end.
    Use a 3m scotch Brite or emery cloth just enough to get rid of the mirror finish.
    I have never in 23 years heard of using oil on them as the last thing I want is lubrication where I need good grip by the needle bearings.
    I don't understand why a lubricant is needed for grip. I scuff the shafts, soak the one-ways in IPA and clean with a rag and a blast with a can of air to dry.
    Unless the shaft is worn enough that there is a noticeable 'divots where the bearings ride the method I use has worked literally thousands of times.
    Scuffing the burnished shaft in the same direction the rollers turn also does not make sense to me as that will cause the needles to only ride the high spots of the surface instead of better lateral contact.

    All you can do is listen to all the advices offered and make up your mind which way to go.
    Trial and error will help you form a routine to handle procedures like this.

    Short 'for instance'...

    I recently watched another tech starting to remove a fuser to replace a t-belt on a 4 series. I laughed out loud. He said it's the only way the belt will come out. I then showed him the 1 stupid screw on the upper guide plate on the t-belt. Removed guide and now the belt comes in and out without obstruction or extra work removing the fuser.

    Now it's the only way he does it.
    But he had to perform it both ways and made his decision to try it the less laborious way and it all worked out
    Good luck and happy trials
    Yes the needle bearings must move slightly in and out. Turn the bearing one direction they move away from the shaft to allow rotation. Turn the other direction and they move toward the shaft to grip it. This movement of the needle bearings gets sluggish after dust, metal particles, and dirt get up in there. They don't move toward the shaft freely enough so you get a loss of grip. if you are reusing the same one way clutches by all means clean them with a solvent or WD-40 to get the crud out. Even soak a Q-tip and clean them out. I don't clean them unless I have to. I rather replace the one-way bearing clutches if I even suspect they are failing. I use one small drop of oil to lubricate the needle bearings to keep them moving in and out freely. Keeping the needle bearings moving freely is the most important way to keep them gripping the shaft as long as the shaft if in good shape. Grooving the shaft in the opposite direction of rotation only causes the needle bearings to jump up and down as they rotate accelerating wear greatly in my opinion. I have been working with one way bearings for 45 years and I think I know what works.

  6. #16
    Service Manager 500+ Posts femaster's Avatar
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by allan View Post
    Yes that will be affordable to do but the shaft only in my experience. Don't get it often that a clutch will fail before 250K. Found that my method works ok.
    Those one way clutches last forever.
    I agree. In my 8-years working with KM, I have only ever replaced a set of oneway bearings once, and that was when I first started out. The machine probably didn't need them, but I was inexperienced with KM machines at the time and didn't know any better. Cleaning them at every tire replacement, yes, but have never had the need to replace.

    Taking some Scotchbright and lightly scuffing the area where the bearing rides works perfectly. We have many machines out in the field with well over 3-million pages through them, and have never needed to change a oneway on any of them. Scuffing the shaft(s) has had no ill effect on the oneways ability to grab and work properly on those or any of our other machines. The shaft only needs a light scuffing, just enough to remove the mirror finish and dull the area where the bearing rides. If any metal is removed at all by doing this, it is so minimal that it makes no difference at all.
    A Ricoh Service Tech for 7 year. A Konica Minolta Service Tech for 7 years. Now, KM service manager.
    My Ricoh knowledge is slowly dwindling away at this point. Many things have been lost to time...

  7. #17
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by mike_hartung View Post
    Talking about the one way feed bearings right next to the pickup roller and the feed roller. They are called feed clutches in the konica minolta parts book. They fail quite often. Replacing these one-way feed bearing clutches and cleaning the shaft should solve your problem.

    I have uploaded a video of the actual two paper pick ups I am talking about
    Please see this and comment !
    https://youtu.be/2u3UIhsaHBU

    You see something sliping ? I don't.

  8. #18
    Service Manager 2,500+ Posts tsbservice's Avatar
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by HOSTAKI View Post
    I have uploaded a video of the actual two paper pick ups I am talking about
    Please see this and comment !
    https://youtu.be/2u3UIhsaHBU

    You see something sliping ? I don't.
    You cannot test easy sleeping OWs. Better swap them with second(working) paper feed drawer ones to see.
    A tree is known by its fruit, a man by his deeds. A good deed is never lost, he who sows courtesy, reaps friendship, and he who plants kindness gathers love.

    Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused.

  9. #19
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by tsbservice View Post
    You cannot test easy sleeping OWs. Better swap them with second(working) paper feed drawer ones to see.
    Both of the Trays (1&2) have the same issue .
    Could it be that the main motor is giving that pick up problem ?

    Anyone have the Bizhub C280 specific parts diagram on a link somewhere ?

  10. #20
    Service Manager 2,500+ Posts tsbservice's Avatar
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    Re: Konica Minolta bizhub C360 - Paper Jam 11-01

    Quote Originally Posted by HOSTAKI View Post
    ...

    Anyone have the Bizhub C280 specific parts diagram on a link somewhere ?
    Parts Catalog > Konica-Minolta > bizhub C280 > page 16
    A tree is known by its fruit, a man by his deeds. A good deed is never lost, he who sows courtesy, reaps friendship, and he who plants kindness gathers love.

    Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused.

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