RJ Young service with unlimited pages

[mloudy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

... if you are the current vendor and the four copiers are on a FMV lease, it is the customer's responsibility to return the copiers at their effort and expense to a destination of the lessor's preference.

You have to play hardball on this one (phrased nicely) to maintain an advantage.

It is very unlikely that the RJ Young quote has built in extra money to return the copiers for a seemless customer experience. The Church could get a signicant unexpected cost to return the copiers.

We have lost 5 clients to a KM dealer. All but one have returned. A church, go figure.

ALL five of them called us a few months into their venture with the KM dealer. Almost word for word they said to us that "We could come pick our our equipment". This was all leased equipment through Wells Fargo. They each were told how a good dealer does business when they acquire a new customer who is leasing equipment from another dealer. Like SSG said RG is likely leaving out any buyout andor shipping charges for the old equipment.

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

... I often see Xerox state to a customer that any leased equipment returns can only be handled by a Xerox approved carrier often at a cost well above market rate. $850.00 is not uncommon.

I make customers aware that I am building this much money into the lease and whatever the acutal charge is, I might have to to make a +/- payment to the customer. Settlement of these shipping charges can involve writing the customer a cheque once the lease is funded.

[BillyCarpenter]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

Quick follow up. I delayed the meeting. The pastor is going out of town so our new meeting will be on the 8th of November. When I spoke to him today over the phone, I asked if he had read the fine print on the service contract and if there was any line that capped the number of pages even though they claimed it's unlimited. He said there was a line in there like that but he had them to remove it. Also, I asked if he could send me a copy of the proposal and he said no. He said that I should be able to give my best proposal without needing to see it. That, IMO, was smart on his part. If I were a buyer, I'd never show the proposal to another vendor. It's makes it too easy to slightly undercut the competition and you're probably not getting the best deal for your company. I could go over his head by going to the other pastor that I do business with but I'm not going to do that.

Instead, I'm going to take this approach. Basically, I'm going to ask him this: If I offered you a billion copies per month at a price that was agreeable to you, are you really getting a billion pages per month? The answer is no because they'll never print that much.

He's gonna send me the page usage over the past year. From there I'll quote him a page count that his high enough that there shouldn't be any overages.

It's still very early in the sales process. I want to end on this note: NEVER BE SCARED TO WALK AWAY FROM A DEAL. A dealer can lose a lot of money if you're not careful. I will give him my best deal and if that's not good enough, walk away. With all that being said, I don't plan to lose. Will follow up when it gets further along.

[mloudy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

We lost a school to a dealer who was with $300 of us over 5 years. $500K plus deal. They had all the "we may" things in their quote that SSG listed. We had decades of usage history which was given to them to do their quote.

Just a few years in and they were wanting out becasue of the horrible service. At the end of the term the school had to cough up an additional $18K for overages because the lowballed the included pages. We were told we lost the deal because our overage cpp was higher. Well, there wouldn't have been any overages if they went with us so the cpp didn't have mattered.

It is too bad he want give you their quote. Maybe you could ask just to see the verbiage and not the actual dollar figures. In their best interest...

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

Many lease vendors will charge a Lease cancellation fee of approx $150.00 if the new lease is not signed with them.

[BillyCarpenter]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

One thing I know without a doubt is there are no free lunches in the copier business. There is no way to offer unlimited pages with one flat fee with no overages. Yet, that is exactly what RJ Young is advertising. I've got to get my hands on that proposal.



From their website:







For areas in which businesses must generate invoices regularly, there is a high margin
For many businesses, the purchase of a printer represents a large capital outlay, although the purchase is tax-deductible. On the other hand, leasing printing equipment can reduce the need for large, up-front payments, help you gain access to new, more advanced machines, and calculate monthly expenses more accurately. And now, RJ Young has magnified these considerable benefits by adding a flat rate printing option to their lucrative leasing program.





Regardless of whether you want an inkjet printer
One Flat Fee Covers Everything


Besides maintenance and troubleshooting, our service plan also includes training to help employees and IT staff optimize usage of print equipment. This ensures that your team can gain full utility of any print equipment and helps minimize potential downtime.


No Meter Readings
While copier or printer meters
Look to RJ Young for Efficient, Cost-Effective Unlimited Printing

As we move through 2021, successful businesses are realizing now more than ever that budgeting must pair resources with smart financial strategies for the right outcome. Holding back spending to gain flexibility and assigning talent to high-priority areas is a must-do for the savvy business owner.

And that is exactly why RJ Young has created the Unlimited Flat Rate Printingcopy and print partners across that country that offers this? That's another one of the advantages of partnering with RJ Young!

https://blog.rjyoung.com/copiers-pri...-rate-printing

[mloudy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

I would say they are going to ALWAYS shoot high so most accounts will well below the amount of pages they calculate will be run and include on the 3 or 5 year contract. I see the don't charge any "overruns" while saying nothing about a customer's monthly ever reducing because they are now running much less than they did when the lease started.

"If the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic has taught modern businesses anything" EXACTLY! If we all had schools and churches signed up for a plan like this and we calculated correctly to cover what they run just think of the profits when they completely shut down for a year. All those churches and schools running nothing yet we got all of our money upfront for 5 years of service. Our churches still have not recovered. My goodness this is the percept conversation to have with a church. They are likely still living in the "what if?" stages of the pandemic.

[BillyCarpenter]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

I would say they are going to ALWAYS shoot high so most accounts will well below the amount of pages they calculate will be run and include on the 3 or 5 year contract.

That's the first thing I thought of but it's an enormous risk (on their part) and if they're quoting cost-per-copy on the extremely high side, it would be easy for the competition to blow them out of the water. But that's the only thing I can think of. But again, the pastor told me there was language in the contract that limited the number of pages but he had them to remove it. I'm wondering if there's more language in there that still limits the pages.

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

That's the first thing I thought of but it's an enormous risk (on their part) and if they're quoting cost-per-copy on the extremely high side, it would be easy for the competition to blow them out of the water. But that's the only thing I can think of. But again, the pastor told me there was language in the contract that limited the number of pages but he had them to remove it. I'm wondering if there's more language in there that still limits the pages.

... in an organization as large as RJ Young, removing a limitation on the number of pages can only happen with the signature of a Regional Vice President. The local sales rep has no authority to to make this change to the contract. To not lose perspective here, this is only a four copier deal. It is not that important to the success of RJ Young. They are not going to change the way they do business.

Unless the Church get's it in writing from the VP, it is not going to happen.

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

I would say they are going to ALWAYS shoot high so most accounts will well below the amount of pages they calculate will be run and include on the 3 or 5 year contract. I see the don't charge any "overruns" while saying nothing about a customer's monthly ever reducing because they are now running much less than they did when the lease started.

"If the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic has taught modern businesses anything" EXACTLY! If we all had schools and churches signed up for a plan like this and we calculated correctly to cover what they run just think of the profits when they completely shut down for a year. All those churches and schools running nothing yet we got all of our money upfront for 5 years of service. Our churches still have not recovered. My goodness this is the percept conversation to have with a church. They are likely still living in the "what if?" stages of the pandemic.

... the nature of the game in One Rate programs is to be cautious on the high side of included prints.

RJ Young is trying to sell the sizzle of Unlimited prints and simplicity of invoicing. The counter is to sell Total Cost of Ownership based upon actual prints made.

As RJ Young is th encumbent copier provider, they do have many built in advantages in this deal. The only way to close the deal, especially in a Church always looking for ways to reduce it's costs, is to low ball the price. Forget about anything more than a 10 % profit margin.

[BillyCarpenter]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

... in an organization as large as RJ Young, removing a limitation on the number of pages can only happen with the signature of a Regional Vice President. The local sales rep has no authority to to make this change to the contract. To not lose perspective here, this is only a four copier deal. It is not that important to the success of RJ Young. They are not going to change the way they do business.

Unless the Church get's it in writing from the VP, it is not going to happen.

I'm just telling you what the pastor told me. I don't think he's lying. So the sales rep either got authorized approval or he pulled a fast one on the customer.


Here's the bottom line as I see it. Either RJ Young has completely turned CPC (cost per copy) on his head and completely rewritten all the rules with it's Limitless Plan, or it's a gimmick. I don't care how big RJ Young is, they still have to pay for Toner, Parts, and Labor.

This is the first time I've encountered this so I really need to see this proposal and go over every word. When I meet with the customer, I'm going to do my best to get it.

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

I'm just telling you what the pastor told me. I don't think he's lying. So the sales rep either got authorized approval or he pulled a fast one on the customer.


Here's the bottom line as I see it. Either RJ Young has completely turned CPC (cost per copy) on his head and completely rewritten all the rules with it's Limitless Plan, or it's a gimmick. I don't care how big RJ Young is, they still have to pay for Toner, Parts, and Labor.

This is the first time I've encountered this so I really need to see this proposal and go over every word. When I meet with the customer, I'm going to do my best to get it.

You have already been told you are not getting a copy of the proposal.

All you can hope for is on the machine side to get the details of the configurations that RJ Young proposes.

Then you do your analysis of what the customer actually needs and get the customer to agree upon the same.

I think the customer is willing to give you their historical print volumes.

From this you can work out what your Total cost of Ownership will be over 60 months and present the same to the customer. The customer seems unlikely to give you the propsed One Rate costs from RJ Young. The customer can calculate the two TCO's themselves once you educate them how to do so.

If you are not 15% lower than RJ Youngs proposal you will probably not get the deal assuming the customer has been happy with the product and services that the incumbent has provided.

[BillyCarpenter]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

You have already been told you are not getting a copy of the proposal.

All you can hope for is on the machine side to get the details of the configurations that RJ Young proposes.

Then you do your analysis of what the customer actually needs and get the customer to agree upon the same.

I think the customer is willing to give you their historical print volumes.

From this you can work out what your Total cost of Ownership will be over 60 months and present the same to the customer. The customer seems unlikely to give you the propsed One Rate costs from RJ Young. The customer can calculate the two TCO's themselves once you educate them how to do so.

If you are not 15% lower than RJ Youngs proposal you will probably not get the deal assuming the customer has been happy with the product and services that the incumbent has provided.

Yes, I was told that he didn't want to give me a copy of the proposal. That doesn't necessarily mean that it won't happen. In my sales career, do you know how many times that I've been told no and eventually end up getting what I asked for? Too many to count. In fact, I just texted the other pastor at the church whom I already do business with at his real job. This is the non-profit school that has 10 copiers with me and I do all their computer work. I installed s security system at his house. I have the keys to all the schools and alarm codes. We're pretty tight. I'm gonna ask for his help in getting the proposal.

I'm well aware of how to write a Total Cost of Ownership proposal. However, I prefer to leave nothing to chance because often times customers don't understand when a copier company is trying to pull a fast one on them. The best odds for me winning this account to go over the Unlimited Plan with a fine tooth comb and it's also in the best interest of the customer.

I already know that they want to move on from RJ Young because they feel like they've paid way too much over the years. But, you're right that I need to give them a reason to change (lower cost) or they probably won't.

[tsbservice]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

was
...I could go over his head by going to the other pastor that I do business with but I'm not going to do that...

is
...I'm gonna ask for his help in getting the proposal...

Dealers... you gotta love them

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: RJ Young service with unlimited pages

I'm just telling you what the pastor told me. I don't think he's lying. So the sales rep either got authorized approval or he pulled a fast one on the customer.


Here's the bottom line as I see it. Either RJ Young has completely turned CPC (cost per copy) on his head and completely rewritten all the rules with it's Limitless Plan, or it's a gimmick. I don't care how big RJ Young is, they still have to pay for Toner, Parts, and Labor.

This is the first time I've encountered this so I really need to see this proposal and go over every word. When I meet with the customer, I'm going to do my best to get it.

... as this is only a four copier deal, only so many copier clicks are possible. RJ Young can simply tell the customer prints are unlimited, eat any deficit in the first year and then increase the One Rate rental by up to 10% per year thereafter should the customer go overboard on their colour click volume. Black clicks do not matter that much.

It takes some significant effort in RJ Young's back end accounting system to change any program. They are not going to do it for a four machine deal.

The One Rate plan is not a gimmick, it is a prepaid copy block with extra Terms and Conditions.