[Jamming] bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time.

[818tech]

Hello Guys!

I have two OCE Imagistics IM-6020 a.k.a. Bizhub-600.

Machine #1:
I checked the paper jam history and it had a jam code
J1103 - (Tray 1 Feed) with [Bypass 11x17]


[Which I’m not understanding (11x17? Tray 1 Feed?)]

From the Service Manual
J1103 {When idling} The horizontal conveyance sensor /Rt (PS6) turns ON while in idling.

So anyway I tried making multiple copies from the Manual Feed Unit (Bypass) and I was able to duplicate the jamming but it’s giving a different code J3101 (2nd Paper Feed Conveyance).

Tried all paper sizes, all orientation, all thickness be it normal or thin. It will jam J3101 (2nd PFC) from (whatever size of paper I put on the MFU).
So machine threw a lot of J3101's when testing.
I'm guessing customer doesn't use the MFU too often maybe it collected dust so I blow canned air on the area with no improvement.

The Physical problem is it will pick up the paper 1/4 way, then the machine will read misfeed.
Sometimes 1st copy will misfeed right away,
Sometimes 1st copy will go through and the second will misfeed.

When this occur, i just remove the jammed misfeed papers in the MFU area,
Check M3 area on the ADU (no paper found in any instance) I just then delete the current job.

All others are fine from T1,T2,T3 & T4.

The machines are located 100 miles away from me and hoping to get inputs before i go back there.

I will do a visual inspection and per this thread below

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _
Re: Bizhub 600 Jamming: Originally Posted by MCBIG
Subject:
Description:
J3101 codes.
Solution:
With paper stopping at the registration roller.
CAUSE: Worn shaft on Registration motor (M5).
SOLUTION: Replace M5 (p/n 27LA 8001 2E for bizhub 600/750 and p/n A0PN M102 00 for bizhub 601/751).
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TATA: Thanks MCBIG. I had already replaced the board and M5. It turned out to be the one way gear (56AA 7716 0 BY PASS FEED INPUT GEAR A 24T0) on the Manual Feed Unit that needed replcement.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _

My Solution:
1st I will inspect the BY PASS FEED UNIT INPUT GEAR A 24T, P/N#: 56AA 7716 0, #24 on Manual Feed Unit, P.45, and other parts in that area and I will replace if necessary then if unsuccessful,
2nd I will replace the M5 Motor, P/N#: 27LA 8001 2E. #9 on ADU P.62.
Crossing my fingers I hope I don't have to replace the Printer Control Unit (PRCB), P/N#: 57AA -902 1J. #6 on Electrical Parts P.67
Any other ideas guys? thank you in advance.


Machine #2:
J1103 – (T1F) with [Bypass 11x17]
J3101 - (2nd PFC) with [Tray 1 Feed].
these codes show same time with same meter count.

Problem: (I tried multiple attempts)
1. The machine will scan originals but will never pickup paper from the MFU (Bypass tray). (Yes, machine is detecting the paper size).
Big start button on orange light, waited for minutes, still the machine will not pick up the paper.
2. Delete Job - Machine will get stuck on the Deleting job, will wait again for minutes, and still hasn't deleted the job.
3. Machine say "Ready to do or accept another Job", Big start button on orange light, don’t remember if will or will not scan new jobs but of course it won’t make copies, and thus, I have to turn machine off/then on to restart.
3. After restarting, I check that deleted jobs, the deleted job will show in history as "deleted due to error".
3. Tried attempts 1 & 2 again, same thing.

T1,T2,T3 & T4 working normal after restart. (The most important thing)

My Solution:
1. I will try to swap the MFU from my parts machine see if it will even pickup (grab) the paper. Maybe I will bring also a PRCB just in case.

Lastly, if I replace the PRCB, do I need to make some adjustments/programming to the machine? Or it's just plug-and-play?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance!

[allan]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

That J-3101 is almost always something to do with the registration clutch.
I will change the clutch before i try any thing else.
If had one machine where developer leaked onto the ADU control board underneath the registration assembly damaging it out giving J3101.

On these machine never look were the paper stops always refer to the jam codes.

For the paper not picking up or slipping in a feed unit there is a one way bearing(clutch) on the pick-up and feed roller shaft that will slip.
Its a white plastic one way clutch that can move on the shaft.
I use a blade to scratch about 4 lines into the shaft where the bearing runs.
Good for fixing 1101 1102 1103 1104 jams.

Yes you can change the boards out but you counters will be all wrong.
Mabe some one here knows a more proper way to do that.

[818tech]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

That J-3101 is almost always something to do with the registration clutch.
I will change the clutch before i try any thing else.
If had one machine where developer leaked onto the ADU control board underneath the registration assembly damaging it out giving J3101.

On these machine never look were the paper stops always refer to the jam codes.

For the paper not picking up or slipping in a feed unit there is a one way bearing(clutch) on the pick-up and feed roller shaft that will slip.
Its a white plastic one way clutch that can move on the shaft.
I use a blade to scratch about 4 lines into the shaft where the bearing runs.
Good for fixing 1101 1102 1103 1104 jams.

Yes you can change the boards out but you counters will be all wrong.
Mabe some one here knows a more proper way to do that.

Thanks Allan! That would be the 1st thing that i will do.
With my retired uncle who works a lot on analog Canon machines, he taught me to consider looking into 2 places. where the paper stops or where the code is, then back-track it.
But thank you for your input, i will be forever grateful to you. This maybe will make my life a little easier now.

On these machine never look were the paper stops always refer to the jam codes.

Is it ok for me to keep in mind for any jamming to look into clutches 1st?

When you mentioned clutch, i hurriedly looked into the Service Manual and Parts Catalog.
the registration clutch (CL1) for jam code J3101 is located in the Registration Unit.
P/N#:56AA 8201 2, #24 on page 26.

I know you said to never look where the paper stops always refer to the jam code,
I'm a little confused because the CL1 is after where the paper stops and it's a little bit far.
I mean, if the code is before where the paper stops, then i would understand it easily because the paper traveled already in those area.
But if its after, then the paper haven't even reached that point thus it's confusing me. For sure there's always an explanation that hasn't been introduced to me.

If you don't mind if you can shed me some light a little more about it? thanks!

And when you said these machine? are we talking about? All Konica's or all Minolta's or all Konica Minolta's or just the Bizhub-600's?
You know when Konica was just Konica and Minolta was just Minolta and when they merged together... (Per my retired uncle)

If had one machine where developer leaked onto the ADU control board underneath the registration assembly damaging it out giving J3101.

Did the leaked developer damage the Registration Clutch (CL1) ? or the ADU Drive Board Assy (ADUDB), P/N#:57AA -904 1E, #15 on page 56.
I'm a little worried coz when i peeked underneath the Conveyance Unit, it's all dirty in there and i tried to open it to clean it up but was not successful, i have yet to find a way, I'm not even sure if that area is accessible.

For the paper not picking up or slipping in a feed unit there is a one way bearing(clutch) on the pick-up and feed roller shaft that will slip.
Its a white plastic one way clutch that can move on the shaft.
I use a blade to scratch about 4 lines into the shaft where the bearing runs.
Good for fixing 1101 1102 1103 1104 jams.

For my other machine, same section Manual Feed Unit (Bypass), It doesn't pickup the paper at all (like no attempt or any movement), machine detects the paper size, it gives you the thickness option of normal or thin or thick or special.
The moment it scans the originals, it won't initiate or activate or budge or pick up the paper from the bypass.

I checked the MFU from my parts machine, it is working fine, i can even hear a mechanized sound if you remove the paper from the bypass tray.
I'm not sure if this was present on the machine concerned coz i did not hear it.
I will bring the whole MFU and swap it to see if it works.

If it will not work after swapping, any other idea?

About the one-way parts, I inspected the Whole MFU and there are four parts that are one-way.
1. Is the actual Feed Roller
2. Is the Gear right besides the Feed Roller
3. The Gear at the other end of the Shaft where the Feed Roller is. And lastly
4. The Gear at the other end of the Paper Stopper Roller Shafr where the green knob is.
I will work on the process of elimination after hopefully my replacement MFU will work the the machine concerned.

By the way, Pick-up and Separation Rollers are free wheeling.

I use a blade to scratch about 4 lines into the shaft where the bearing runs.

I usually sand paper mine if i refurbish the one-ways.
So your "scratch" is it parallel of the one-way or crossing?

Thank you in advanced!

[818tech]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

That J-3101 is almost always something to do with the registration clutch.
I will change the clutch before i try any thing else.

Update: I'm sorry Allan, but other Feed Units T1 thru T4 doesn't Jam. only when I use the Manual Feed Unit (Bypass). And I was able to really duplicate the problem multiple times and gave me the J3101 code paper coming from the bypass even with a 8.5X11 normal paper. I alternate trying it from T1 - T4, no jamming at all. Only at the bypass and every single try it will misfeed & the code would be J3101. Bypass will only grab the paper 1/4 way then stops.




maybe the feed timing is too slow from the bypass & the Registration clutch run out of time? oh no!

[allan]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

Hehe. Your are over whelming me with your response.
Sorry for leading you down the wrong path.

So its 2 different machines ??

The one where the tray 1 to 4 works and only the bypass is faulty that is where you are getting the J3101.
There is nothing wrong with the ADU that is good news.
Did you remove the bypass\entrance section for a good look around there.
Can you change it out with another one?

What is confusing me it that PS44 is the registration sensor and PS43 the lead edge detection sensor.
The paper must first actuate PS44(registration sensor a photo interrupter) then the clutch will activate after a small delay for loop creation then the paper must pass PS43(photo reflective sensor for lead edge detection) to time the image.

There is a loop adjustment setting in service mode -> machine -> printer registration loop adjustment
Its can be changed for T1-T4 ADU or bypass. Hope you are testing with plain paper.

Does the paper edge touch the registration sensor but does not get to the registration roller or is the paper still far from the registration sensor?
Hope you have another machine to swap parts with that would make things easier.

[allan]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

Use the parts manual to identify the sensor positions.

[818tech]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

Hehe. Your are over whelming me with your response.
Sorry for leading you down the wrong path.

No worries

So its 2 different machines ??

Yes.

The one where the tray 1 to 4 works and only the bypass is faulty that is where you are getting the J3101.
There is nothing wrong with the ADU that is good news.
Did you remove the bypass\entrance section for a good look around there.

I'm scheduling a visit, it is 100 miles away from me.

Can you change it out with another one?

Yes, I will replace the whole Manual Feed Unit (Bypass) with a good used pulled-out from my parts machine.

What is confusing me it that PS44 is the registration sensor and PS43 the lead edge detection sensor.
The paper must first actuate PS44(registration sensor a photo interrupter) then the clutch will activate after a small delay for loop creation then the paper must pass PS43(photo reflective sensor for lead edge detection) to time the image.

There is a loop adjustment setting in service mode -> machine -> printer registration loop adjustment
Its can be changed for T1-T4 ADU or bypass. Hope you are testing with plain paper.

Yes, I use plain paper. I will look into this, I haven't done this before. I hope it's a walk in the park and won't affect the other feed trays timing.

Does the paper edge touch the registration sensor but does not get to the registration roller or is the paper still far from the registration sensor?
Hope you have another machine to swap parts with that would make things easier.

It stops before the PAPER STOPPER ROLLER (Shaft) of the bypass, P/N#:56AA 4251 0, the shaft with the two rubber rollers, same shaft where the "green" roller knob is on, P/N#:56QA 4274 0.
The lead edge of paper would be after 2-3 inches from the bypass pickup roller, then machines reads misfeed. jam history code J3101 (2nd Paper Feed Conveyance) from Bypass.
On the jam history at two events 3K copies apart, it had a code J1103 [(Tray 1 Feed) When Idling] from Bypass 11X17 and J3101 (2nd Paper Feed Conveyance) from Tray 1, both codes at the same time.
During my visit, I tried to make copies to find out whats going on, i run the machine thru T1-T4 no problem, but when i run Bypass even with 8.5X11 plain paper it will misfeed and the code is J3101 (2nd PFC) from Bypass.



The other Machine,
It had only a one time J1103 code [(Tray 1 Feed) When Idling] from Bypass 11X17.
I made sample copies, T1-T4 no problem, but when i run Bypass with also 8.5x11 plain paper, the Bypass will not move to pickup the paper from the bypass tray (no action at all).
Machine will scan the originals but no action from the Bypass.

Thank you so much in advance Allan.

[allan]

Re: bizhub 600, Mach. #1. J1103 and will not pu bypass. #2. J1103 and J3101 same time

Wish you well with these machine. Get them to upgrade these old beasts.