[Jamming] Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

[orestesp]

Greetings,

We have a Aficio MP5001 with approximately ~1,200,000 clicks on it. It was bought used, and basically every consumable (e.g. OPC drum, charging roller, etc) was, assuming from how bad the prints were coming out, completely worn out. I replaced everything apart from the developer (used a different PCDU whose developer was slightly used) and the heat roller and thermistors and had decent print quality ever since. I also gave the conveyance and paper feed rollers a good cleaning with a paper towel and some WD-40, while the rest of the copier was cleaned from toner and paper dust with a paper towel and IPA.

We load A4 80gsm paper on Tray 1 and Tray 2, and A3 80gsm paper on Trays 3 & 4.

The story starts with Tray 1. It would no-feed jam every 20-30 sheets or so. After some time, it would refuse to feed paper from Tray 1, and I thought, fair enough, it must have been the one tray that saw the most use during its lifetime, so I assumed the paper feed rollers (pick-up, feed and separation) must be worn out and need to be replaced.

I didn't give it much thought at that time, because my hands were full and we had 3 more trays that were working just fine. The machine thinks that the jam occurs at the door on the bottom left of the machine (I am more familiar with KM machines, and KM calls it "vertical conveyance unit") while in reality, the paper never really leaves the tray. It will either not get picked up by the pick-up roller, or it will be picked up, but it won't make it to the vertical conveyance unit.

Same thing started to occur with Tray 3. The paper will either barely make it through the paper feed unit or will not be picked up at all, and then the machine will jam with J005.

I then placed my poor phone inside Tray 3 and captured a video of what's going. The pick up roller would spin but fail to grab onto the paper and push it far enough so the feed roller would do the rest (see: MP5001 - Album on Imgur).

After taking a look at the PM tables in the service manual, I was surprised to see that that there is no mention of ever needing to replace the paper feed rollers - it only recommends cleaning them every now and then. Am I missing something here?

Currently, only Tray 2 works reliably, but only with trash-quality A4 80gsm paper - after loading some good quality A4 80gsm it would fail to feed every other sheet or so. Paper setting for all trays is set to "Plain".

Is there anything else I can do apart from replacing the pick-up, feed and separation rollers for each malfunctioning tray?

Thanks in advance.

[Phil B.]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

Greetings,

We have a Aficio MP5001 with approximately ~1,200,000 clicks on it. It was bought used, and basically every consumable (e.g. OPC drum, charging roller, etc) was, assuming from how bad the prints were coming out, completely worn out. I replaced everything apart from the developer (used a different PCDU whose developer was slightly used) and the heat roller and thermistors and had decent print quality ever since. I also gave the conveyance and paper feed rollers a good cleaning with a paper towel and some WD-40, while the rest of the copier was cleaned from toner and paper dust with a paper towel and IPA.

We load A4 80gsm paper on Tray 1 and Tray 2, and A3 80gsm paper on Trays 3 & 4.

The story starts with Tray 1. It would no-feed jam every 20-30 sheets or so. After some time, it would refuse to feed paper from Tray 1, and I thought, fair enough, it must have been the one tray that saw the most use during its lifetime, so I assumed the paper feed rollers (pick-up, feed and separation) must be worn out and need to be replaced.

I didn't give it much thought at that time, because my hands were full and we had 3 more trays that were working just fine. The machine thinks that the jam occurs at the door on the bottom left of the machine (I am more familiar with KM machines, and KM calls it "vertical conveyance unit") while in reality, the paper never really leaves the tray. It will either not get picked up by the pick-up roller, or it will be picked up, but it won't make it to the vertical conveyance unit.

Same thing started to occur with Tray 3. The paper will either barely make it through the paper feed unit or will not be picked up at all, and then the machine will jam with J005.

I then placed my poor phone inside Tray 3 and captured a video of what's going. The pick up roller would spin but fail to grab onto the paper and push it far enough so the feed roller would do the rest (see: MP5001 - Album on Imgur).

After taking a look at the PM tables in the service manual, I was surprised to see that that there is no mention of ever needing to replace the paper feed rollers - it only recommends cleaning them every now and then. Am I missing something here?

Currently, only Tray 2 works reliably, but only with trash-quality A4 80gsm paper - after loading some good quality A4 80gsm it would fail to feed every other sheet or so. Paper setting for all trays is set to "Plain".

Is there anything else I can do apart from replacing the pick-up, feed and separation rollers for each malfunctioning tray?

Thanks in advance.

I NEVER use WD-40 (basically OIL) on feed rollers.. get Rubber Roller cleaner or even IPA... oil n paper don't mix well.
as far as no life stats mentioned

LOOK AT THE DAMN PM Tables .. it clearly states in there,

[Coptech]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

Replace the feed rollers but you may also need to disassemble the feed units enough to clean the one-way bearings within them in different locations. There was an old bulletin about a longer bushing at one time also. I assume tray 1 is giving you a jam code 3? That is no pick-up. 1.2M is a pretty full life for that machine. Especially with it's age.

[orestesp]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

I NEVER use WD-40 (basically OIL) on feed rollers.. get Rubber Roller cleaner or even IPA... oil n paper don't mix well.
as far as no life stats mentioned

LOOK AT THE DAMN PM Tables .. it clearly states in there,

I very much did, as I mentioned in my original post, and it has no mention of when the rollers need to be replaced. See picture attached.

Imgur: The magic of the Internet

Replace the feed rollers but you may also need to disassemble the feed units enough to clean the one-way bearings within them in different locations. There was an old bulletin about a longer bushing at one time also. I assume tray 1 is giving you a jam code 3? That is no pick-up. 1.2M is a pretty full life for that machine. Especially with it's age.

Hi, thank you for taking the time to read my post.

Yes indeed, Tray 1 is giving me a J003.

I searched the service manual for the one-way bearing that you mentioned, but found nothing for it. Could you please elaborate on this? Also, I am not a tech, but I do service our machines, so I am not aware of the service bulletins issued by Ricoh.

Finally, how much more life can I get out of this machine? Is there anything that I would want to replace if it hasn't been replaced by now?

Thanks.

[Phil B.]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

I very much did, as I mentioned in my original post, and it has no mention of when the rollers need to be replaced. See picture attached.

Imgur: The magic of the Internet Thanks.

that is just ONE page of it...

as you see it only mentions one table notice the 800pg table isn't include

as for the one-ways...

you will see them in the Parts manual... there is no life for the one-ways... you just have to do the suggested adjustments.

also you used WD-40 when the table tells you WATER

having serviced Ricohs.. Rubber cleaner was OUR preferred cleaner.

[orestesp]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

that is just ONE page of it...

as you see it only mentions one table notice the 800pg table isn't include

as for the one-ways...

you will see them in the Parts manual... there is no life for the one-ways... you just have to do the suggested adjustments.

also you used WD-40 when the table tells you WATER

having serviced Ricohs.. Rubber cleaner was OUR preferred cleaner.

The PM table on this particular manual has no other mention of the paper feed rollers apart from the one page that I posted. I did try water+paper towel, and when that didn't work I used WD-40, which has worked well for me when cleaning the dirt from the rubber rollers on our KM production machine, but it unfortunately aslo didn't work. Unfortunately, my hardware shop doesn't sell a rubber rejuvenating solution.

I am unaware of the suggested adjustments for the one-way bearings, as well as the bearings themselves. I have a copy of the parts manual, are the one way bearings the ones that I've highlighted in the attachment below? Are these the ones that Coptech mentioned need to be cleaned?

Thanks.

PC_v02-MP4000-5000.pdf

[slimslob]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

I very much did, as I mentioned in my original post, and it has no mention of when the rollers need to be replaced. See picture attached.

Imgur: The magic of the Internet



Hi, thank you for taking the time to read my post.

Yes indeed, Tray 1 is giving me a J003.

I searched the service manual for the one-way bearing that you mentioned, but found nothing for it. Could you please elaborate on this? Also, I am not a tech, but I do service our machines, so I am not aware of the service bulletins issued by Ricoh.

Finally, how much more life can I get out of this machine? Is there anything that I would want to replace if it hasn't been replaced by now?

Thanks.

If you had looked at the page of the recommended PM levels that you attached you would have noticed that the proper way to clean rollers is with water. WD40 leaves an oil film that causes the rollers to slip. The feed rollers are not mentioned because the table only goes up to 800K while the blue composite roller are supposed to last as long as 1M. That is under ideal test lab conditions. In actual operation they seldom go beyond 800K and usually fail around 600K. If the surface of the feed roller is slick/shiny, it is time to replace all three as a set. The older black rollers were rated to go 300K but usually lasted as much as double that.

The only thing that WD 40 is useful for is to remove ink marks from the covers and then Goo Gone or creamy peanut butter work better.

[orestesp]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

If you had looked at the page of the recommended PM levels that you attached you would have noticed that the proper way to clean rollers is with water. WD40 leaves an oil film that causes the rollers to slip. The feed rollers are not mentioned because the table only goes up to 800K while the blue composite roller are supposed to last as long as 1M. That is under ideal test lab conditions. In actual operation they seldom go beyond 800K and usually fail around 600K. If the surface of the feed roller is slick/shiny, it is time to replace all three as a set. The older black rollers were rated to go 300K but usually lasted as much as double that.

The only thing that WD 40 is useful for is to remove ink marks from the covers and then Goo Gone or creamy peanut butter work better.

Like I said, I initially used water to clean the rollers, and when that didn't work, I used WD-40, which was recommended to me by a tech when asking for advice on how to clean the rollers when no rubber rejuvenator was available. It did a good job of cleaning the rollers and it fixed the problem on our KM machine, and I saw no harm in using it here as well.

I do not live in the United States, and the only thing I can think of that is sold here as a rubber rejuvenator is one of those sprays that they sell at gas stations that makes your car tires look like they're new.

Since the rollers are obviously beyond their useful lifetime, they will be replaced.

However, Coptech mentioned something about the one-way bearing the some bushings, if someone could explain to me what I need to do with those and if there's anything in general that would need replacing on a machine this age with as many impressions as it currently has, I'd be grateful.

[tsbservice]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

Hi orestesp, I remember you posted recently in KM section with good success and support.
Every brand is different but...cleaning rollers help with some limitations. Sometimes you just need to replace one ways clean them scrub shafts or even feed clutches are sleeping. Look at the way tyres are driven swap parts if possible with other trays.
Just my 2 cents.

[slimslob]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

However, Coptech mentioned something about the one-way bearing the some bushings, if someone could explain to me what I need to do with those and if there's anything in general that would need replacing on a machine this age with as many impressions as it currently has, I'd be grateful.

The 3 rollers are the pickup roller, the reverse roller and the feed roller. The feed roller has a one-way bearing in it that allows it to turn free on the shaft in the feed direction after the clutch turns off.

On the feed roller for the bypass and the LCT the bearing turns the opposite direction.

[Phil B.]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

Hi orestesp, I remember you posted recently in KM section with good success and support.
Every brand is different but...cleaning rollers help with some limitations. Sometimes you just need to replace one ways clean them scrub shafts or even feed clutches are sleeping. Look at the way tyres are driven swap parts if possible with other trays.
Just my 2 cents.

I was going to get yo the 1ways n shafts.. wanted to see what you n slim mentioned 1st. I concur with both.
I looked at his profile.. not a tech but emd user..
Y'all have fun.. I'm done.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Coptech]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

I assumed that you were a tech and had some experience servicing this copier. I am hesitant to give too much information as I can potentially cause you more harm than good if you start tearing your machine apart. The one way bearings require removing the complete paper feed assembly for each tray causing problems. (I would stick to tray one as the 2nd tray is harder to get access to) The design of a one way bearing is to lock and drive in one direction but freewheel to make for easy jam removal or when the paper is "handed off" to the next set of rollers. They do not sell them by themselves. They will be with the gear or lever they are pressed into. Clean them with alcohol, clean and lightly buff the shaft that goes through them with fine emery paper, and put a drop of oil in them. They need some lubricant to make the needle bearings travel freely and lock to the shaft. Again, this is a better project for a tech that has experience with this model. As for life expectancy, that is hard to say. Yours has had a long full life and probably "wants to go into the light". It is like trying to predict when a lightbulb will fail. A prediction like that is better left to the professional psychics. Good luck either way.

[slimslob]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

I assumed that you were a tech and had some experience servicing this copier. I am hesitant to give too much information as I can potentially cause you more harm than good if you start tearing your machine apart. The one way bearings require removing the complete paper feed assembly for each tray causing problems. (I would stick to tray one as the 2nd tray is harder to get access to) The design of a one way bearing is to lock and drive in one direction but freewheel to make for easy jam removal or when the paper is "handed off" to the next set of rollers. They do not sell them by themselves. They will be with the gear or lever they are pressed into. Clean them with alcohol, clean and lightly buff the shaft that goes through them with fine emery paper, and put a drop of oil in them. They need some lubricant to make the needle bearings travel freely and lock to the shaft. Again, this is a better project for a tech that has experience with this model. As for life expectancy, that is hard to say. Yours has had a long full life and probably "wants to go into the light". It is like trying to predict when a lightbulb will fail. A prediction like that is better left to the professional psychics. Good luck either way.

You're thinking of the 60-90ppm Martini models and then only to replace the one-way gears on the back end. Feed replacement on the 4001/5001 is the same as on all 40/50 and older 35/45 models.

[Coptech]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

You're thinking of the 60-90ppm Martini models and then only to replace the one-way gears on the back end. Feed replacement on the 4001/5001 is the same as on all 40/50 and older 35/45 models.

A one way in the lever that rotates the reverse roller, One in the sep roller gear behind the torque limiter, and one in the black gear also on the drive. Feed assembly has two screws towards the front side of machine, connector or two at the rear, and it rocks forward and out.

You are right, I am getting old and memory not like it used to be but fairly sure I am picturing the correct feed assembly in my mind. Still, not a good job for an amateur. Hence the warning and disclosure. Thanks for keeping me on my toes though.

[Phil B.]

Re: Aficio MP5001 No feed jam

I assumed that you were a tech and had some experience servicing this copier. I am hesitant to give too much information as I can potentially cause you more harm than good if you start tearing your machine apart. The one way bearings require removing the complete paper feed assembly for each tray causing problems. (I would stick to tray one as the 2nd tray is harder to get access to) The design of a one way bearing is to lock and drive in one direction but freewheel to make for easy jam removal or when the paper is "handed off" to the next set of rollers. They do not sell them by themselves. They will be with the gear or lever they are pressed into. Clean them with alcohol, clean and lightly buff the shaft that goes through them with fine emery paper, and put a drop of oil in them. They need some lubricant to make the needle bearings travel freely and lock to the shaft. Again, this is a better project for a tech that has experience with this model. As for life expectancy, that is hard to say. Yours has had a long full life and probably "wants to go into the light". It is like trying to predict when a lightbulb will fail. A prediction like that is better left to the professional psychics. Good luck either way.

and it's a line drive to the right outfield...

Like Coptec said.. buff shafts to slightly roughen the the surface.

on 1ways after cleaning *as described above* put 1 drop of light oil ( I use TriFlow it has Teflon particles infused ) then place on shaft TIP and turn it slightly to move the oil into the inner hub of the pins. *the pins will stay lubed longer due to that and the Teflon*

the reason I say spin on tip of shaft... you don't want excess oil in that area due to sticky residue after the oil dries due to heat.

you can find in most hardware/home improvement/auto parts if you have a walmart they carry it

Amazon.com : SUPERIOR LUBE TRI-FLOW 6oz DRIP BOTTLE : Bike Oils : Sports & Outdoors