MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

[oldschool]

I have talked to two Technicians in as many days with the MP2852 copier and connecting to the key counter connecter. It seems the count pulse has a constant voltage. Ricoh support thought the board is bad but when I see two of the same model with the same symptom I think it may be something more.
Does anyone have a key counter or vending device connected to a MP2352, 2852 or 3352 key counter connecter.
I'd also be interested if anyone is using the type A EDP interface board.

Thanks

[oldschool]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

I'm told today buy a Tech who worked with Ricoh Tech support that the new Ricoh models do not support the use of the key counter connector. Support told the Tech that the type A EDP board is required. This tech was working on the MP6001.

Anyone else heard of this?

[TonerMunkeh]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

Yeah I've had to fit the type A board on a few machines that use key counters, I think one actually was an MP6001. Other was a 4501.

[RG1964]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

Yep, you have to buy the ' optional counter interface unit type A '. For almost all new machines.

Saw an old list:

This is a test ecommerce deployment PROD PAGE

[oldschool]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

The Tech that was told to change out the BICU board still has the same symptom.
I've been told via email from some Engineers at Ricoh that the 4 pin key counter should still work. The manual should show all the pin outs and signals. A Ricoh Senior Product Specialist told me he tested the key counter connector on the MP2852 and it worked without issue. I have advised the Techs on site to switch to the interface board and try it. While I'm sure this will get the customer up and running, I'm not sure of what is causing the initial problem.

It looks like I have some people telling me the interface board is needed and I have others telling me it's not.

If anyone has any documentation or a tech pub number from Ricoh stating the Type A EDP board is required to use a key counter; could you send it to me or tell me where I can find it. Then I can give all parties involved a definitive answer.

Thanks

[RG1964]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

I haven't found any information on a Ricoh site.
In the field we've noticed that it didn't work. Even the (20 pin) connector was removed from the Bicu board.(6001 series)
You can replace all the boards you want, it won't work. There's no pulse on that connector.
Check the point to point diagram (6001).

[oldschool]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

From what I know so far you are correct. Some folks at Ricoh think that's incorrect. I was hoping for something in writing. I have not heard back from the Product Specialist for the MP6001 as of yet. My email to Ricoh has been forwarded to a few departments. I've only heard back from the MP2852 Product Specialist. I may be misunderstanding something. Once the board is in, we connect to it via the 20 pin connector. I have never gone back and checked to see if the 4 pin connector works after that. Is the 4 wire key counter output dependent on the interface board being installed?

[teebee1234]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

I just hooked up an equitrac with a 4 pin connector to an MP6001 and it worked - sort of. The previous machine it replaced (MP6000) utilized it with no problem, but apparently the 6001 requires the A kit to be fully functional. Sales wasn't aware at the time of order that it wouldn't work and has an order in for the interface. Currently the symptoms are that when the user logs in, the meter won't increment until after the machine powers off. Also a 5 minute countdown timer on the equitrac is supposed to reset automatically after every job while the user is logged in, which it won't with the 4 pin setup. An MPC6501 I setup the same day at the same account replaced an MPC6000 that had the 20 pin adapter. I switched it over and it works flawlessly.

Did you enable the key counter in SP?

[oldschool]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

All the SP modes and Ext Charge Unit Management options are set correctly.
When you install the interface board on the MP6001 are you planning to connect the equitrac to the 20 pin on the interface board or do you think the 4 pin will work correctly once the interface board is installed?

[teebee1234]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

Ok, this may be the reason - I stopped off at the office this evening to pick up to 20pin Equitrac cables for a customer with an MPC7501 and MP6001 (still waiting for the A adapter to arrive). The solutions tech printed off a web page from Equitracs cable lookup site with the installation instructions and at the bottom of the page was an advisory from them -

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CABX0121 (4 pin cable) is not recommended for this model due to counting issues
REASON: The 4 pin keycounter interface port for connection to cable CABX0121 on this model does not output a reliable enough copy pulse signal to ensure Terminal will capture all page counts. Consequently, the terminal will either undercount or continuously display ZERO for page counts.
Therefore, use ONLY as designated CABX0721 with the Ricoh "Optional Counter Interface Unit Type A (413012)" kit required to be installed by dealer.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would imagine this could be the same issue with the MP2852.
Hmm, you would think our tech support would be aware of this.

[oldschool]

Re: MP2852 Key Counter does not pulse.

After installing the Type A EDP board and connecting to it and not the key counter connector everything works as it should.

I believe the problem is caused by a constant voltage of 5 VDC at the key counter. It's normally 0 and jumps to 24 VDC. Most vending equipment uses opto isolators to detect the copy/count pulse. Because there is a constant voltage these components never see a change. There may be a voltage change from 5 to 24 volts but to this component its all the same. A mechanical counter can't be tripped by the lower voltage. When the voltage jumps there is enough energy to trip the counter. I think that's what Ricoh used for their test and that's why they believe there isn't a problem.
It could be that way by design but who knows.

The customers are happy!
Thanks for your help!