1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

[Counsel]

Im having this issue on a 1055. I figured i would do the safe thing and just replace all 3 clutches in the duplex, and both clutches in all 3 feed units. This seemed like it worked for about a week and the problem came back. Most of the jams register as 12 (relay sensor) i checked the sensor its ok, the machine runs fine on single side. So i figured timing issue. It seems to be at the pause when duplex should be entering back to the registration I get 2 pages in the under side of the duplex one coming in and one just about to go into registration and the machine just stops saying jame in b2 gate, and E5 under duplex there usually is no paper in b2 nothing came out of feed or duplex to registration. I dont think its the duplex itself everything works, its like feed unit just didnt know what to do and stopped.

It seemed like when i ran tray 2 i was able to duplex, but if i ran tray 1 i got about 2 pages out before it jammed. I am just about to check or replace the timing pulley and belt for tray 1, and the drive gear on machine side. From what i can tell tray 2&3 have a seperate timing belt from the first tray.

Any suggestions that might aid me.

[Lagonda]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Hmm, only had one of those in our fleet and that was some time ago. If I remember correctly all the feed problems started after after dev leaked out the back of the dev unit and went through all the gears and clutches. We replaced the clutches but still played up like a second hand chainsaw until all the gears and bearings were replaced as well. I think we had to replace the complete feed station for tray 1 before we got some reliability again. Sorry to be so vague but that was some time ago.

[TonerMunkeh]

If it's not the feed stations it's more than likely the registration mylars. Pull the reg unit and see if they're badly worn.

[Counsel]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Well I havent pulled the registration yet, i peaked up in there when i had the dev unit and pcu out and was checking the relay, the only thing is these are like old versions of the mp5500s and usually when i see those machines have registration mylar issues i see tick corners or jams actually in the registration. My jams occur before anything has even got to the registration, the duplexed pages are still in the duplex and the nothing has come out of the feed unit yet, and from feed unit to exit section there is no paper, its like it never fed paper from the feed unit, i dont have much of these either. I guess one question is when there are 2 sheets in the underside duplex is the feed unit pausing to let them move one to the registration or should the feed unit have already sent 1-2 pages on past the pcu and fuser at that point. Im not really sure because these run so slow on the timing compared to the new models.

I did have all 3 feed units out when i replaced the clutches, there was no developer or anything in the gears, not to mention this machine only has 500k pages on it total which seems like very little for it to be leaking dev, but i did clean all the shafts on the feed units with alcohol there was more dust then anything, I know im no expert on these with just a couple years in the field but this one seems out of the normal suspects for me. Ive rebuild feeds for the 5500's and the 3260's but this almost seems like timing, i just dont have a working machine to compare.

Thanks for the advice though, ill keep working at.

[pocket aces]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

X 2 on the registration mylars

[Bantams]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Is the reg sensor under the dev unit clean?

Seems odd if tray 2 works fine and only the LCT as the problem maybe the LCT feed rollers are worn try swapping feed units around to eliminate them.

also are you sure its only done 500k some people put new nvrams on machines to resell them

[Counsel]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Im pretty sure the 500k page count is right this customer got the machine in 05' with less then 10k on it, from my history records nvram was never replaced that our company knows of and they have only done the 500k since it was installed 7 years ago. I will check the mylars in the registration again they looked fine when i looked at them while i had the pcu and dev unit out to clean sensors. Ill probably check the feed timing belts and see what kind of mess i can make in there.

[Ollie1981]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

If I am not mistaken this was the newer variant of the 551/700 before they replaced it for good with the 1075 range. Think I may have only saw one or two of this particular model, the 1055 anyhow, they didn't seem to be all that popular in this neck of the woods.

I had a load of 551's/700's to deal with a few years ago, beyond clutches (which you've covered) I'd be looking at registration mylars especially if the machine has the external LCT. Also behind the power supply I seem to remember there being the paper feed drive, the belts and pulleys. I'd check the condition and tension of the belts and also the pulleys. I remember having a whale of a time with a 700 some years ago where one of the pulleys had cracked just enough for the flat of the shaft to occasionally spin inside the pulley causing random jamming (although on second thoughts this may have been a Bellini 850/1050 - can't rightly remember - but they are broadly similar)

I remember that being a battered high miler though, it's worth checking if you're drawing a blank elsewhere as it isn't that big of a job to pull out the PSU and have a look.

[Counsel]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Ok so here some interesting info, My first visit back the other day i took the back off removed the psu and stuff out of the way, removed the timing belts, pulleys cleaned the off then tightened the belts to be snug, ran a few hundred pages no problem. I get called back the next day for jamming and I find paper bunched in the bypass so i take the side all apart and I find a big chunk of green plastic that doesnt look like anything from inside the machine, i showed the lady by themachine and she said that looks like my water bottle that i dropped and shattered on the floor about a week ago.

Oh nice finding foriegn objects in the bypass side of the registration. So I took it all apart didnt find anything else in there and the mylyars look barely used no nicks or major wear damage. So I am pretty confident the mylars are fine.

I noticed when it did jam on me I counted the pages feeding, 1 was in the output bin, the other 2 were in the underside of the duplex. There should however have been a sheet by the transfer belt or fuser by this time and there wasnt, meaning nothing came out of the tray when it was supposed to feed so i dont think my problem is solved because it seems like a feed issue out of tray 1 which is a tandem tray unit, there is no external lct. So its working today we will see how it goes but if starts jamming again I think its a feed unit issue when it stops for the duplex pages it never feeds again.

[kannuki2]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Okay. I hope this will help you out. KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID (KISS Rule)

1st: Run about 20 sheets single side paper off from Tray #1, does that jam on you?

No, run it through tray#2, is it jam?
still no, run it through tray #3 single side only

If all three trays fed and ran fine. Then you know the paper feed are good.

2nd: Run 20 sheet duplex on tray #1, if that jams then concentrate on the duplex unit.
There are three flag sensor on the duplex unit. Sometimes, it get knocked out of position after removing the jam.

[Counsel]

Re: 1055 jam 12 (relay) but only when duplexing

Thought I would post an update on this.

I ended up doing a few things in total i replaced the duplex clutches, all 3 feed unit clutches, and checked/tightened the timing belts for the feed units, i had removed the pcu/dev units cleaned the registration sensor, checked everything out. After all that it seemed to work good. I get called back about 3 days later for a jam which turned out to be paper stuck in the bypass so I was like whew not a duplex problem, i removed the paper and find this huge chunk of lime green plastic a couple of the customers were standing there and i showed them, and the one cust says wow that looks just like a piece of my water bottle that i dropped a few weeks ago and it shattered all over the place.

So ya i pulled the sides off and checked everywhere that I could see, only found that one large piece and haven't been called back to work on it since.