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Guitarist69
01-15-2010, 07:09 PM
A long story but we purchased a used CF2002 from a copier tech that claimed to provide the sales as well as the service. Basically, we paid extra to have it set up as well, and he interfaced it to our network, got it printing, but could not get it to scan. Said he would send another tech out the next day to finish up the install, but never showed since we made the mistake of paying him in full when it was delivered. After numerous attempts, he won't return any calls and is nowhere to be found. In fact, I believe he's even a member of this forum - but that is not my reason for posting -plus I don't want to get into the legal issues of our recourse which we are pursuing.

The more we look into it, we are finding other issues with it(Missing parts, cables not connected, bad printing, higher counts than origianlly claimed, and other lies, etc). At this point we are trying to figure out if it is worth it for us to put some additional money into it to or just ditch it. Aside from the printing side of it(which we can live with - may need some new IUs), but we really need it to scan. The tech claimed it was supposed to have the hard drive(HDD-5) in it, but was missing(And that is why it won't scan), but I am trying to determine if there is any way to get it to scan without a HDD(My understanding is that only affects certain distribution options)..

What is concerning is the scan button won't activate at all(Not even with an error), and there are 2 cables with connectors by the PWB-C board that aren't attached to anything and wonding if that is part of the problem. I don't have a problem bringing a tech out here to address this issue if I could confirm that everything needed to scan is there, but at this point I don't know. I included 2 pictures below of the 2 cables that are not connected, and not sure where they go, can't imagine them connecting back to the PWB-C board since that is where the wires originate from. Is there a component missing that these should connect to.

I am sorry to ask these basic questions but I really need some direction on what to do. I also would like to ask if anyone could recommend a good tech in the Los Angeles/Orange County area that is very familiar with the CF2002 and could give us an honest assessment of what we have to work with. If we decide to keep it, we will need a good tech for our business servicing of this unit.

Thank you for any assistance in this difficult situation.

Albonline
01-15-2010, 09:09 PM
if this unit is what i think it is (konica 8020) its old as the hills and about 6 months away from obsolesence. therefore not worth very much effort/expence.

KEVIN900
01-15-2010, 09:43 PM
Hate to say it, but you bought yourself one old dog. Although in any copier, there will be empty slots in control boards, and wiring harnesses that do not seem to connect to anything. they're usually reserved for various options and upgrades. But anyone selling a CF2002 is a junk dealer.

Guitarist69
01-15-2010, 10:17 PM
I appreciate the replies, I understand its an old model - If it was fully functional, it would suit our limited needs. Can the scan function work without a hard drive installed. One other item - On the PWB-C board there are 4 little light indicators marked R93, LED2,R102, LED1 respectively - the one marked LED2 is flashing - does this indicate a malfunction of some sort .

Thanks

fixthecopier
01-16-2010, 12:16 AM
Flashing red on a board does not mean there is a problem. The machine , when in good shape is a work horse. It sounds like you got a raw deal. I still have two of these new in the box, I can't give away, and a full used system with a little less than 100,000 on it and several other units. I would love to make someone a truckload deal, but you do not want to own anything you can not get a good tech to service. Hope you did not pay a lot, I am trying to sell the new units for $1500 obo each.

JustManuals
01-16-2010, 12:28 AM
This Parts & Service manual can now be purchased for $11.77 and downloaded immediately after payment from The Internet's largest collection of manuals (http://www.justmanuals.com)

Stirton.M
01-16-2010, 03:51 PM
You got screwed by this guy.

The machine is considered obsolete here in Calgary. We do not even carry basic parts for them anymore.

As much as I despise the C350, you would have at least been better off with that machine.

Now, as to your machine. If it copies and prints without problems, then do not worry yourself about flashing lights and disconnected plugs. If there were a serious problem with the machine, it would throw a service code.

The lack of a hard drive on the main body will limit your scanning ability but will not prohibit it. The hard drive allows to parse a multi page document as a single file. Without it, you will get multiple files of one page each, or in the case of email, multiple emails with one page each.

The basic setting for scanning is as follows.

Solution ID TAUS0630896EN* Solution Usage 0
Description
SCANNER CAN NOT BE USED NOW message displayed after pressing the SCAN button.
Solution
CAUSE: Incorrect setting of the controller or peripheral mode.
SOLUTION: Change the Peripheral mode of the controller to CONTROLER 2, MODE 1. To do this perform the following:
1. Access the Tech rep mode (press the [UTILITY] button and select [meter count], press Stop, 0, 0, Stop, 0, and 1).
2. Select System Input.
3. Select Peripheral Setting
4. Select Controller 2, Mode 1.
5. Press END.
6. Press FIN. TIME to return to the main copy screen.

Bad printing may be due to the image units you mentioned, worn transfer belt or worn fuser or maybe the LED bed. Or perhaps it just needs adjusting and cleaning. Site unseen, just guessing really.

Is it worth fixing? Well, if you want it to print well, no. The cost of those consumables would exceed the cost even "Fixthecopier" is willing to sell his machines, and as I understand are brand new for $1500 plus transport costs.

I advise you to call your local KM Branch and see if they are willing to send out a tech to help you out.

And if you know the tech who sold you that POS from here, name them. Reputation is important to some here and we can ensure they either help you out or....well...can't beat em up for ya....:rolleyes:

Guitarist69
01-18-2010, 11:49 PM
Thanks for the help. I am still having difficulty getting the unit to even go into scan mode - When i press the scan key, the key won't light up and nothing happens it doesn't even show "Scanner Cannot be Used" message per the tech builtin. I changed the Controller to Controller 2, Mode 1, but that didn't help - Won't go into Scan Mode at all

I did notice in the System Input menu that under Hard Drive it was set to "Unset" so i tried changing it to "Set" since I was originally told it had a Hard Drive, and Pagecope Light then acknowldged a 10gb HD being installed, but then it started showing Error code C-12CO on the main menu, which related to the HD not being attached to the PWb-F. Does that sound right - could it stillhave the HD installed but not connected correctly. Is there an easy way to physically check - I can't figure out where the HD would be located in the unit(Not in the service manual). I really don't want to get into but am still trying to figure out what I actually have in order to decide how to proceed-whether to hire a tech or just dump the unit, and go after the seller in small claims court.

The individual that sold the unit is on this forum under the name "kmteck" - real name Chris Menera. He is selling his stuff on Craiglist and he also is advertising on the net under a name of Digital Imaging Systems even though its not a legitimate company from what I can tell. I did not pay alot for the unit so I probably got what I paid for, but the real issue is him making promises and statement about the unit condition, the included parts and accessories, and his servicing of it, and then not following through once we paid him in full. On delivery day, we were supposed to get an 8031 with the Fiery controller, but he showed up with the CF2002 with the regulat controller(claimed that Fiery wouldn't work with our Win7). Speedwise the CF2002 is not the same as an 8031 but we accepted it. He got it to print, but could not get it to scan, and said it was because the Hard Drive that was supposed to be included was not in there, and he would send a tech out the next day to resolve it - That was the last we saw of him since we paid him at delivery. We later realized that it was missing some parts in the glass area - missing IR right cover, bad printing etc. We correspondended via email and a few phone calls and he lead us to believe he would resolve the issues, but now at this point he's avoiding our emails and calls.

Any more help you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

Stirton.M
01-19-2010, 03:29 AM
Hmmm....I had seen a few of his posts here and there...he seemed to me a knowledgeable fellow, willing to help. I dunno what to say about that aside from trying to contact him through his profile via PM.

As for the 2002, it is the same as a 3102 or for that matter, an 8031 for the most part. Physically there is little difference between the three variants aside from speed as you noted.

I am a bit confused however that you are not able to get the controller to allow scanning. I need to verify, do you have a fiery controller on the machine? It should look like the one on the following link....click the thumbnails for larger image. Basically, there is a white coloured metal box attached to the back side of the main body of the copier.

Print Controllers CN3102e Print Controller, Fiery X3e+ 960839 CN3102e X3e Fiery X3e 31C-M (http://www.arcservicesco.com/anon/itemDetails.aspx?ItemID=1368)

This gets its power directly from the copier and should initialize with the copier's main power switch. It usually takes about 5 minutes for the fiery to fully initialized (it is like a computer, though very slow to boot one).

If you do not have one of these and are printing from the internal controller of the 2002, this is a bit different. It is referred to as the 3101e fiery controller. It is inside the main body of the copier, rather than simply mount on the back side. If you look at the right side of the copier, the exposed silver metal plate on the rear side will contain the controller in the upper right portion. Not much there aside from the network port. See first attached image for a drawing of what I am referring too, highlighted in yellow. If that is what you have, the controller type is wrong and should be set to type 3. I've included the setup instructions for this controller for you to use.

As for the hard drive, the error code you got was related to that. It is most likely missing. Not that it has to be there. This is considered an option. See HDD5 setup instructions for this.

Though I doubt the hard drive is required for scanning, I could be wrong. Quite frankly, all the machines I have ever worked on came fully loaded and all had the 3102e controller.

Hopefully we can get you going though. Outside of this, I defer to fixthecopier's expertise on these machines.

mrwho
01-19-2010, 09:05 AM
I'm sorry for only stumbling with this post today. I have a couple of these machines which I am responsible for, and maybe I can be of help if any help is possible with your problem.

Clarify just a couple of things with me, please:

- You can copy and print without problems?
- You problem is only with scanning documents to your computers?

Guitarist69
01-20-2010, 01:58 AM
Thanks to everybody with the help thus far - I am making progress, but still not scanning yet. To answer the poster above - I am printing and copying okay -just not scanning yet

I have the 3101e controller (Tech was supposed to provide the Fiery CN3102e but ended up bringing out a unit with the 3101e). I pulled the control board out to verify I do not have a hard drive installed as I was supposed to have.

I activated the Controller 3 for scanning, and now can get into the scan menu(I set up ftp and also email settings) and can get the unit to go through the process, but still no scanned document in either mode. If I understand the previous posts , without the Hard drive, even if i get scanning to work, it will create multiple files of one page only(even with FTP) - This is going to be an issue as I need to scan large documents.

In any case, I set up a small ftp server with some free software mentioned elsewhere on this forum(Typsoftftp) and believe I have it configured correctly, but when I run the scan, after 15 seconds or so the CF2002 keeps coming back with a message "Job has been done improperly - Check the record". When i check the FTP server log it shows the CF2002 connecting to the ftp server, connecting the user and directory, but then shows the CF2002s IP address as disconnected, so something is causing it to drop the connection. I also made sure my router is allowing traffic through port 21(FTP).


I am so close . . .

you guys have been so helpful thus far . . .

On another note - anybody have a hard drive kit for this system that they would want to sell for cheap, as I am most likely going to need it if we get this working and I am sure the other tech is not going to provide it at this point.

Thanks

Stirton.M
01-20-2010, 05:16 AM
Ok...semi-easy part...

You can use a standard laptop hard drive. If you look at the setup instructions I posted earlier, you will see there is a special mounting bracket and right angle plug. Its been a very long time since I looked at one of these, but I am assuming you could likely get away with a special ribbon connector to connect between the board and the hard disk instead of the molded plastic thing shown in the manual. It is possible someone could sell you this install kit minus the drive and you can get one yourself. Because of the age of this series machine however, I am uncertain what the maximum drive size is for this. A slightly newer C350 can handle 160Gb for certain, but this...not sure if there is an upper cylinder limit (old PC issue) that restricted drives to below 132Gb. You might have to make the ribbon cable connector custom. But it should work in a pinch. Mounting might be another isssue.

As for the scanning, good to see we have that part dealt with.

There is a specific way to create the scan to ftp buttons. Basically you need to create the ftp port itself separate from the scan buttons and then through the scan buttons use that ftp tunnel to send your file to a specific directory on that ftp.

The user manual can be found through this link, the manual on the bottom of the page, to download, click the blue icon on the right side of the page.

Konica Minolta Knowlegebase (http://207.194.48.151/intranet2/browse.php?sess=0&parent=4978&expand=1&order=name&sortname=ASC)

See attached images for the specifics

Guitarist69
01-20-2010, 06:36 AM
Thanks again for all of the good info. I did set up the FTP functions already as detailed above but will try again tomorrow, maybe with another FTP server software - Another thread discussed a user having issues getting TypsoftFTP to work with a Cf3202 but it worked with Quick n easy FtP, so that could be my issue as well, as it is communication with the ftp but the job is not finishing.

Regarding the hard drive, I had heard you could use a laptop drive . . . I will figure this one out.

I am really thankful for all of your help . . .

Stirton.M
01-20-2010, 08:08 AM
Funny that one thing that is so often overlooked is that windows has a built in FTP server. Go into add/remove programs, select "Add/remove windows components" Place a check mark beside "Internet Information Services (IIS)" and click ok. You will be prompted to insert the windows cd. After a short while, IIS will be installed. It has a web host, so you could literally set up your own website locally on your computer and browse to it through your local network. FTP also comes with that. No need to buy anything. And as long as the pc is behind a router and separate from the net, it is secure.

Hell, even Windows 7 comes with it.

There is some reading involved...actually, quite a bit...IIS FTP is by no means simple, but once it is set up, it will function quite well to your needs.

Speaking of firewall, this may be your problem on the PC you are trying to scan to. To verify, disable the firewall on that PC and try a scan.

Guitarist69
01-20-2010, 08:40 PM
I got the scanning to FTP working. I ended up ditching typsoftFTP and switched to Quick N easy FTP and got it working no problem. As you said it parses out multipage documents into separate files because of the missing harddrive, but at least its scanning now - Cool

I have now been working on getting the scan to email function going but not sure if its possibey since we are not on an exchange email server(We use outside pop3 mail- Yahoo Business Mail). I contacted my ISP provider(AT&T) and obtained alternate smtp setting for our DSL account that aren't using SSL or authentication but it doesn't seem to work. I am starting to think it cannot be used with outside servers since most of them have security to protect against spam etc and the CF2002 doesn't let you set up those options(SSL etc). Is there any other option, such as a way to set up a small smpt server on our internal network, or another outside(preferably free) email service that would work for this - We are really just trying to scan to email accounts within our company.

Stirton.M
01-21-2010, 01:56 AM
Good show!!!:D

Having no direct experience with AT&T, I cannot advise what you may need to do.

However. In your network settings for the copier, you will need to set the DNS entries that will allow the machine to look outside your network. Taking an assumption, you are connected to your DSL modem via a router or switch. Usually the switch will provide DHCP information it obtains from the DSL modem back to your computers on the network, the DNS entries as part of this. Though DNS is primarily Domain Name related, the entries allow the computers to access the internet through the router without any issues.

The copier however works using TCP/IP values, which typically doesn't need DNS, yet the machine is dependent on this anyway.

You can web into your router to glean this information from the WAN tables, or in some cases depending on your network setup, you can get this info from a DOS prompt.

From the start menu, click "Run" and type in cmd and press enter. A command prompt will open. In this window, type in "ipconfig /all" (without the quotes) and press enter.

You should get a response back that will show you your network connection settings as they currently are. Again, depending on your computer, the results of the returned information vary. See attached for what I see with my setup. In my case, only names for the DNS search were provided. Other computers will show the numerical DNS entries, depending on the OS.

Basically, make sure the subnet mask and gateway address is identical to your network. DNS settings should be set to your ISPs entries.

If they give you a name address, you need the numerical equivalent in the email transmit entry. You do not need to set the receive entry, you can use a loopback of 127.0.0.1 there. You will need to set the administrator address and copier address fields. For the moment, set the copier to your address. Depending on your setup, you may need to set the authentication information, meaning a user name and password...again, use your email name and email password for this while testing.

As before, refer to your manuals on how to set these items up.

mrwho
01-21-2010, 08:50 AM
Well done! Thank you for sharing the conclusion with us.

Turn out, although I'm quite familiar with the main body itself (the Konica version), I know nothing of the Minolta controller.

Guitarist69
01-21-2010, 08:21 PM
From my router I have 2 DNS entries(1 and 2) and a Default Gateway address, as well is an IP address(Which would change because I am on a dynamic IP) but not sure which I should be using and where on the CF2002.

Under the network menu of the CF2002, Under TCP/ IP, I have IP address(Which I have set to 192.168.1.25 to designate the copier on my network), Subnet Mask(set to 255.255.0.0), and Gateway Address which was originally set to the routers address of 192.168.1.1, but I tried substituting one of the DNS entries and then the default Gateway address from the router, but no Joy. Am I entering in the right information at the right place.

Guitarist69
01-25-2010, 09:47 PM
Ok...semi-easy part...

You can use a standard laptop hard drive. If you look at the setup instructions I posted earlier, you will see there is a special mounting bracket and right angle plug. Its been a very long time since I looked at one of these, but I am assuming you could likely get away with a special ribbon connector to connect between the board and the hard disk instead of the molded plastic thing shown in the manual. It is possible someone could sell you this install kit minus the drive and you can get one yourself. Because of the age of this series machine however, I am uncertain what the maximum drive size is for this. A slightly newer C350 can handle 160Gb for certain, but this...not sure if there is an upper cylinder limit (old PC issue) that restricted drives to below 132Gb. You might have to make the ribbon cable connector custom. But it should work in a pinch. Mounting might be another isssue.



I bought a 30gb hard drive(Didn't want to go too big for compatibility issues) and made a mounting bracket so I am all set on that end.

But the connector is causing me problems. since the connector on the board is 44 pin laptop IDE as well as what's on the laptop drive(Not using the 4 pins for jumpers) I thought a simple connector would work, so I tracked one down online, but it doesn't appear to be a direct pin to pin configuration as I am getting a C12CO error now, which is communication failure between PWB-F and HD. Without the actual original connector as a guide, i can't determine the pin lineup. Does anybody have access to one to figure out or have just the connector to sell.

I am soo close yet so far . . .

Stirton.M
01-26-2010, 01:30 AM
On C350 series machines, a simple ribbon cable was the interface between the board and the drive.

In the case of the 2002, that interface was a right angle connector.

Unfortunately, to my knowledge, there is no pinout diagram for that interface. Perhaps someone else might have one, I am not sure.

Guitarist69
01-26-2010, 01:49 AM
Thanks - I figured out the pinout - The PWB-F board is nonstandard so I just have to get a cable made by someone - The problem is IDE connectors are not to common anymore.

Stirton.M
01-26-2010, 06:18 AM
No, they are not. It is likely easier for you to contact a local KM shop to see if they can source you one. If we had one and you came to visit, we'd likely give it to you. Dunno about other shops though.

Guitarist69
02-11-2010, 07:49 PM
I finally got the right connector for pin lineup and hooked a 30gb hard drive up that I know is good(tested it on another computer), but I am getting error code C-12CF once it is set. It is not the connector at this point as this is a different error code than previously with the wrong connectors. It wont let me format it. Any ideas what it could be?

Thanks for any help you can provide.

Stirton.M
02-12-2010, 05:36 AM
Go into tech rep, format the hard disk.

Guitarist69
02-12-2010, 05:24 PM
Sorry I didn't explain thoroughly first time around- Hard Disk format does not work- Sits at 0% , resets and comes up with error. Hard Drive is good though.

I'm at my wits end on this copier - Everthing else is working pretty much except for the hard drive, which is affecting scanning and printing speeds.

n3o
02-12-2010, 06:07 PM
i had this problem these days, mount back the hdd to the computer and delete partition with a bootable windows cd , DO NOT CREATE either fat32 or ntfs partition, after deleted the partion close the pc and mount the hdd to the copier , the machine will make his own partition when formatting, this is TESTED
ps: the hdd does not influence the print or copying speed in a good way, as i seen, for me it's even worse, copying it's slow now :( ... only thing i find good it's that you can scan one job after another without having to wait the first one to end, maybe i've done something wrong , i don't know what to do, now when i disable the hdd , the memory it fills more fast than before, i cannot work with the hdd because it's slow, and on the memory it only prints 50 pg (with 50 less that before i mounted the hdd) :( i'm getting pissed:(

Nisar235
02-13-2010, 08:59 PM
hi
i am sending you a software name which is FIERY REMOTE SCAN 5.0 download it from link Konica Minolta Australia (http://solutions.konicaminolta.com.au/support/drivers.cfm?.aspx) and when the download is complete you have to give the fiery's model and ip address and install the software. your copier will start scaning.
regards,
nisar khan
Pakistan

Stirton.M
02-13-2010, 11:51 PM
hi
i am sending you a software name which is FIERY REMOTE SCAN 5.0 download it from link Konica Minolta Australia (http://solutions.konicaminolta.com.au/support/drivers.cfm?.aspx) and when the download is complete you have to give the fiery's model and ip address and install the software. your copier will start scaning.
regards,
nisar khan
Pakistan


The guy is not using a 3102, he is using a 3101 internal controller....huge difference.

Guitarist69
02-14-2010, 09:33 PM
Correct - I am using the 3101e internal controller - I will try to delete the partition on the HD and see if that helps. I bought the HD new off ebay but i was surprised that it was originally preformatted for Win- plugged into my computer it immediately recognized it - I thought the CF 2002 format would auto correct the pre partition but maybe your right in that it doesn't.

Regarding speed- I am hoping the HD will help as the copier prints about 4 ppm right now with no hd and everything else is set up correctly - I was assuming it is because its using the system memory which is only 128mb(which is the max allowed). The other memory on the board is 512mb, but I think thats for scanning - which is also slow. I am hoping this is the issue as I am out of ideas on how to get it working, and have spent just about as much as I want to for this old unit

On note though - I got Paperport 12 pro document management software, and the cf2002 works good with it(Twain controller) and makes multipage pdfs(without the HD) but it is still slow.

Guitarist69
02-16-2010, 01:27 AM
Unfortunately - a previously created partiion was not the problem - the drive had no partition on it. In any case, I went through the process to make sure it was completely clean.

Unfortunately I keep getting the error of C-12CF once the drive is set, and then when I try to format- it doesn't move forward. I have a 30gb drive - could it be too big for the CF2002 - could that be the problem.

Anyone know specifically what C-12CF error code means - The service manual just say its a hard disk erro with no elaboration.

I am getting tired of this system.

mailderrick
04-14-2011, 08:00 PM
Did you ever get this resoved? Alo i am filing a claim against mr. Juan Christian Menera . he also took us over. Anyone that wants to join feel free to contact me.

waqas2211
05-05-2011, 12:25 AM
hi for the code c-12co u have to go to ur pannal utility options there u go to harddisk and disable i just did with two machines thy r perfect nw coz the first buyer was using external disk now they removed so just disable it will work .upload the print immage iwill tell u how to fix other problem
from waqas

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