Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

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  • Starglider
    Technician
    • Jan 2023
    • 18

    Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

    Is there any reason a German phone wouldn't work when connected to a US phone jack? I bought an RJ11 to RJ11 cable to replace the RJ11 to TAE-F (German standard plug), but I get no dial tone. Thanks in advance.
  • Hansoon
    Field Supervisor

    Site Contributor
    2,500+ Posts
    • Sep 2007
    • 3297

    #2
    Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

    If the phone is from Siemens, than yes.
    Even here in Germany, Siemens found it a good idea (idiotic) to change the pinout of the RJ11 jacks. With Siemens, the two outer pins have the function of the two inner pins on the normal RJ11 jacks in the rest of the world.

    Hans
    " Sent from my Intel 80286 using MS-DOS 2.0 "

    Comment

    • Starglider
      Technician
      • Jan 2023
      • 18

      #3
      Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

      Haha simultaneously to your message I just discovered that was the issue! It's actually a Samsung, but still I had to rewire the RJ11 cable so the inner 2 wires became the outer 2 at the other end. Now it works! 👍

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      • Starglider
        Technician
        • Jan 2023
        • 18

        #4
        Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

        Originally posted by Hansoon
        If the phone is from Siemens, than yes.
        Even here in Germany, Siemens found it a good idea (idiotic) to change the pinout of the RJ11 jacks. With Siemens, the two outer pins have the function of the two inner pins on the normal RJ11 jacks in the rest of the world.

        Hans
        Gah now I have another problem. This Samsung fax phone isn't detecting incoming calls. In other words it can't hear the phone ring or detect the call coming in. I read somewhere that may be another known issue. Do you have any tips for me? Thanks in advance.

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        • Hansoon
          Field Supervisor

          Site Contributor
          2,500+ Posts
          • Sep 2007
          • 3297

          #5
          Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

          Have no knowledge about Samsung phones and am surprised they are irritating their customers like those idiots at Siemens. There could not be ANY technical reason for wiring those RJ11 jacks different from the rest of the world.

          Sorry not being of any help here.

          Hans
          " Sent from my Intel 80286 using MS-DOS 2.0 "

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          • slimslob
            Retired

            Site Contributor
            25,000+ Posts
            • May 2013
            • 35058

            #6
            Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

            Originally posted by Hansoon
            If the phone is from Siemens, than yes.
            Even here in Germany, Siemens found it a good idea (idiotic) to change the pinout of the RJ11 jacks. With Siemens, the two outer pins have the function of the two inner pins on the normal RJ11 jacks in the rest of the world.

            Hans
            In other words, line 2 of what in the US would be a 2 line jack. there are splitters that can do the job without having to rewire the jack.

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            • slimslob
              Retired

              Site Contributor
              25,000+ Posts
              • May 2013
              • 35058

              #7
              Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

              Originally posted by Starglider
              Gah now I have another problem. This Samsung fax phone isn't detecting incoming calls. In other words it can't hear the phone ring or detect the call coming in. I read somewhere that may be another known issue. Do you have any tips for me? Thanks in advance.
              What is the model of the Samsung fax phone? Have you tried searching for an operation manual for it?

              Comment

              • Starglider
                Technician
                • Jan 2023
                • 18

                #8
                Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                Originally posted by slimslob
                What is the model of the Samsung fax phone? Have you tried searching for an operation manual for it?
                It’s the Samsung SF2500. The user manual is German and has no info about ring voltages or reasons for not detecting incoming calls. This is the service manual: SF2500_SM_SAMSUNG_EN.pdf - Google Drive

                Here’s the link where they suggest voltage differences may cause a German phone not to ring in the USA: Can a European telephone work in the U.S.?

                Not such a problem for a basic phone as one could use a separate ringer to know someone is calling, but the fax is rendered unusable because it doesn’t know when to answer calls automatically. It simply doesn’t know anyone is calling.

                Any ideas how to overcome it?

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                • PrintWhisperer
                  Trusted Tech

                  250+ Posts
                  • Feb 2018
                  • 434

                  #9
                  Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                  Originally posted by Starglider
                  ...
                  Any ideas how to overcome it?
                  What is the Mode setting? Auto TAD/FAX switching? Have you tried FAX only Mode?

                  Until the line is 'picked up' there is no detection of FAX vs Phone, so unless the device answers a call and listens for the pulsed 1100hz tone it cannot know what to do.
                  "Being ignorant is not so much a shame, as being unwilling to learn" - Benjamin Franklin

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                  • Starglider
                    Technician
                    • Jan 2023
                    • 18

                    #10
                    Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                    Originally posted by PrintWhisperer
                    What is the Mode setting? Auto TAD/FAX switching? Have you tried FAX only Mode?

                    Until the line is 'picked up' there is no detection of FAX vs Phone, so unless the device answers a call and listens for the pulsed 1100hz tone it cannot know what to do.
                    Well that's exactly the problem. Yes the fax machine is set to auto answer in fax mode. But it can't auto answer because it has no idea anyone is calling. And that is because this German device can't detect the US ringing signal.

                    If I send a test fax to the machine, I can manually answer, and receive the fax. But even I don't hear a ringing from the machine, I have to just guess.

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                    • ZOOTECH
                      Senior member of CRS

                      Site Contributor
                      2,500+ Posts
                      • Jul 2007
                      • 3381

                      #11
                      Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                      Is the country code set for Germany or the United States?
                      "You can't trust your eyes, if your mind is out of focus" --

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                      • slimslob
                        Retired

                        Site Contributor
                        25,000+ Posts
                        • May 2013
                        • 35058

                        #12
                        Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                        Is it that the phone doesn't ring or that the either the fax or builtin answering machine doesn't function.

                        Check the MODE setting. In Automatic TAD / FAX switching, the phone WILL NOT ring.

                        If you are wanting to use it primarily as a phone it needs to be in TEL only mode. Also check that IN PBX which set the ring pacing. Wrong setting and it will not recognize the incoming ring regardless of mode.

                        There also should be some tyoe of selection for ring volume.

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                        • Starglider
                          Technician
                          • Jan 2023
                          • 18

                          #13
                          Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                          Originally posted by slimslob
                          Is it that the phone doesn't ring or that the either the fax or builtin answering machine doesn't function.

                          Check the MODE setting. In Automatic TAD / FAX switching, the phone WILL NOT ring.

                          If you are wanting to use it primarily as a phone it needs to be in TEL only mode. Also check that IN PBX which set the ring pacing. Wrong setting and it will not recognize the incoming ring regardless of mode.

                          There also should be some tyoe of selection for ring volume.
                          At page 17 the service manual declares proper ring detect operation
                          to be V= 45 to 75 V and f= 23-54 Hz, so if the device is operating
                          correctly it will not respond to US ringing signal of 20 Hz. I find
                          no option to change this (which correctly corresponds to European
                          ringing frequency (except maybe France) of 25 Hz.

                          My question now is how can I adjust the phone line signal from 20Hz to 25Hz?

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                          • slimslob
                            Retired

                            Site Contributor
                            25,000+ Posts
                            • May 2013
                            • 35058

                            #14
                            Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                            Although the common frequency used in the United States is 20 HZ and in Europe is typically 25 Hz, it can be any frequency between 15 and 68 Hz.

                            It is more likely to be the ring pacing and not the frequency. Have you checked the IN PBX setting? PABX and PST ringing patterns are not the same. Many fax machines and other devices that have electronic tone ringers instead of actual bells will not respond if either the length of the ring, 1 or 2 seconds and the length of the pause between rings is not correct. PST ringing is 2 seconds on 4 seconds off. PABX might be 1 second on and 5 seconds off and will not always be detected by the timing circuit if the setting is not correct.

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                            • slimslob
                              Retired

                              Site Contributor
                              25,000+ Posts
                              • May 2013
                              • 35058

                              #15
                              Re: Should a German phone work when connected to a US phone jack?

                              Samsung USA does not recognize that model number. Can you post it as a pdf file, not a scanned file or a link to where we can down load it and have it translated to English. Google translate can handle complete files as long as they are textual pdfs and not scanned pdfs.

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