best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

**D_L_P** · 09-30-2021, 03:39 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by reckless

I am a book publisher who prints 3M impressions a year. I want to do 10M+. My books are 6x9" text duplex and generally distributed freely. Which is the cheapest and most reliable monochrome production printer? Speed is not an issue as long as printer doesn't need attention. Want something without maintenance contract. Prefer something that will never die, smaller footprint would be nice. Don't need any finishing as I manually perfect bind.

If you want something without a maintenance contract I'd check out some HP workgroup printers. An account I worked didn't want one production printer and instead had six HP 9050's with LCT options. They ran non stop all day. Each lasted several million prints. Those things were tanks.

They only needed PM kits at regular intervals. After a few million prints something like a reg assembly or feed unit may need replaced.

Everything was chargeable and IIRC the most expensive call was $800. Most service calls were $200-300.

They don't make the 9050's anymore but the HP LaserJet Enterprise 700 M712n should be an equivalent replacement.

**SalesServiceGuy** · 09-30-2021, 03:54 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by D_L_P

If you want something without a maintenance contract I'd check out some HP workgroup printers. An account I worked didn't want one production printer and instead had six HP 9050's with LCT options. They ran non stop all day. Each lasted several million prints. Those things were tanks.

They only needed PM kits at regular intervals. After a few million prints something like a reg assembly or feed unit may need replaced.

Everything was chargeable and IIRC the most expensive call was $800. Most service calls were $200-300.

They don't make the 9050's anymore but the HP LaserJet Enterprise 700 M712n should be an equivalent replacement.

... and how much did those HP original toners cost? Well, well above the all inclusive cpc rate of a production copier. I do not think this solution is even close to the lowest TCO which is what is what seems to be this customer's ultimate goal.

Were the toners ever out of stock? With HP in 2021 like many print vendors, likely!

... still an alternate solution.

The chances of finding two used production copiers in the same configuration, delivered, installed, PM'ed for $20k are too small to consider.

**reckless** · 09-30-2021, 04:46 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by D_L_P

If you want something without a maintenance contract I'd check out some HP workgroup printers. An account I worked didn't want one production printer and instead had six HP 9050's with LCT options. They ran non stop all day. Each lasted several million prints. Those things were tanks.

They only needed PM kits at regular intervals. After a few million prints something like a reg assembly or feed unit may need replaced.

Everything was chargeable and IIRC the most expensive call was $800. Most service calls were $200-300.

They don't make the 9050's anymore but the HP LaserJet Enterprise 700 M712n should be an equivalent replacement.

I have 2 HP 9050 from years ago without LCT. This post was half inspired by that experience as they never died or went down. They were a bit slow but I can leave things running overnight. They are tanks and were a bit loud and noisy, doesn't bother me. Do you know if they were using aftermarket toner? I had good luck with $20 toners. I never used it for super big jobs as I didn't buy the LCT. I saw some for sale $100/ea some years ago. I still use one for printing on label stock.

Originally I wanted a more production style machine but starting to contemplate this route. I bought a brand new HP Laserjet enterprise 725F at auction for $100 for my dads bedroom as his KM C353 kept going down that he never used. Not sure if its anything comparable. I think biggest problem will be paper output tray not able to stack so much paper.

**SalesServiceGuy** · 09-30-2021, 05:11 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by reckless

I have 2 HP 9050 from years ago without LCT. This post was half inspired by that experience as they never died or went down. They were a bit slow but I can leave things running overnight. They are tanks and were a bit loud and noisy, doesn't bother me. Do you know if they were using aftermarket toner? I had good luck with $20 toners. I never used it for super big jobs as I didn't buy the LCT. I saw some for sale $100/ea some years ago. I still use one for printing on label stock.

Originally I wanted a more production style machine but starting to contemplate this route. I bought a brand new HP Laserjet enterprise 725F at auction for $100 for my dads bedroom as his KM C353 kept going down that he never used. Not sure if its anything comparable. I think biggest problem will be paper output tray not able to stack so much paper.

... you will certainly get exactly what you pay for.... you just might not realize it for awhile. Good luck!

Loading paper all of the time into small paper trays has a labor cost that i do not think you are factoring in.

Off loading paper all of the time from small output trays has a labor cost that I do not think you are factoring in.

These two tasks alone, printing 830,000 prints per month is a full time job ... assuming you can find a reliable person to do it.

Plus order/manage/recycle toner + clear paper jams + clean + install Maintenance kits.

I calculate 8 hours x5 days x $15.00 hour living wage = $600.00 week x 4 = $2,400.00 per month.

$2,400.00 x 60 months = $144,000.00 or you could just be happy and get a new production printer with service contract.

**BillyCarpenter** · 09-30-2021, 05:16 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by reckless

I have 2 HP 9050 from years ago without LCT. This post was half inspired by that experience as they never died or went down. They were a bit slow but I can leave things running overnight. They are tanks and were a bit loud and noisy, doesn't bother me. Do you know if they were using aftermarket toner? I had good luck with $20 toners. I never used it for super big jobs as I didn't buy the LCT. I saw some for sale $100/ea some years ago. I still use one for printing on label stock.

Originally I wanted a more production style machine but starting to contemplate this route. I bought a brand new HP Laserjet enterprise 725F at auction for $100 for my dads bedroom as his KM C353 kept going down that he never used. Not sure if its anything comparable. I think biggest problem will be paper output tray not able to stack so much paper.

Not no, but hell F'n no.

Before you do this, here's what you need to do:

Take all the money you have and put it in a neat plie in the middle of the floor. Then pour some gasoline on it and set it on fire.

**wjurls** · 09-30-2021, 05:23 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Try to find 2 off lease Bizhub Press 1250's or 3, 1052's. Good for well beyond 25 million and seem to do better the higher the volume.

Fast, Cheap, Reliable (<--pick 2)

**reckless** · 09-30-2021, 07:17 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by SalesServiceGuy

... you will certainly get exactly what you pay for.... you just might not realize it for awhile. Good luck!

Loading paper all of the time into small paper trays has a labor cost that i do not think you are factoring in.

Off loading paper all of the time from small output trays has a labor cost that I do not think you are factoring in.

These two tasks alone, printing 830,000 prints per month is a full time job ... assuming you can find a reliable person to do it.

Plus order/manage/recycle toner + clear paper jams + clean + install Maintenance kits.

I calculate 8 hours x5 days x $15.00 hour living wage = $600.00 week x 4 = $2,400.00 per month.

$2,400.00 x 60 months = $144,000.00 or you could just be happy and get a new production printer with service contract.

I fully agree, labor is definitely the issue with this idea. Also speed. I do have workers I can have pickup paper every 2 hours but still I prefer if I didn't have to.

**D_L_P** · 09-30-2021, 08:09 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by SalesServiceGuy

... and how much did those HP original toners cost? Well, well above the all inclusive cpc rate of a production copier. I do not think this solution is even close to the lowest TCO which is what is what seems to be this customer's ultimate goal.

Were the toners ever out of stock? With HP in 2021 like many print vendors, likely!

... still an alternate solution.

The chances of finding two used production copiers in the same configuration, delivered, installed, PM'ed for $20k are too small to consider.

This was at a bank and I'm sure they spent a lot on toner. They had a pallet or two of toner, so maybe they're the reason it was hard to get.
Our sales guy could never sell them on one or two production copiers. I'm not sure why. Nobody mentioned costs.
They didn't like the idea of relying on 1 or 2 machines. With 6 they could still print thousands is pages per day if one or two went out of service.

**D_L_P** · 09-30-2021, 08:42 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by reckless

I have 2 HP 9050 from years ago without LCT. This post was half inspired by that experience as they never died or went down. They were a bit slow but I can leave things running overnight. They are tanks and were a bit loud and noisy, doesn't bother me. Do you know if they were using aftermarket toner? I had good luck with $20 toners. I never used it for super big jobs as I didn't buy the LCT. I saw some for sale $100/ea some years ago. I still use one for printing on label stock.

Originally I wanted a more production style machine but starting to contemplate this route. I bought a brand new HP Laserjet enterprise 725F at auction for $100 for my dads bedroom as his KM C353 kept going down that he never used. Not sure if its anything comparable. I think biggest problem will be paper output tray not able to stack so much paper.

They mostly used oem. Being a bank I guess they didn't care about costs.
With 5 of those running constantly while I serviced the sixth it was noisy in that room. Each one had a stacker option too.
Two operators went around loading paper and emptying the stackers all day. In spite of the high volume I'd only get a call every other month or so.

If I were going to get a production printer I would get Canon or a couple HP's. Canon 55 ppm or faster are tanks.

**tsbservice** · 09-30-2021, 09:17 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

I'm wondering what the bank client has to do with this client.
Nothing in common. Tight budget is limit on this one.

**Zesti** · 10-01-2021, 01:45 PM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

What a coincidence....
Yesterday I got an inquiry for a print solution.... 70m prints in 2 months..... I was like WOW....
The solutions so far I have searched are Bizhub Press 2250P and Xerox Nuvera 314, of course multiple units are required. The catch is each sheet to be printed has unique bar code and QR code.... each side..... So any thoughts about it...

**KeviM** · 10-02-2021, 01:07 AM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

At that kind of volume you definitely need a press or digital press. Make it 2. And something with good speed.

Forget about not spending money if you doing that volumes of printing. Because of the mechanical and electrical parts that make up any machine (or car) you will need to spend money to maintain it.

Remember it takes money to make money. You may want to keep this cheap but going too cheap now will cost you more later. Lots more.

My advice is look at a good digital press with a good service contract and also read the other comments again. These guys are giving great advice coming from good experience, especially the Konica Minolta press comments

**KeviM** · 10-02-2021, 01:43 AM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by allan

Konica Minolta Pro1100. 40 mil life cycle at 110ppm. 1 mil plus a month. Take the maintenance agreement.

Good advice. Go this route

**reckless** · 10-03-2021, 12:47 AM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Why is everyone soo big on the maintenance agreement? It costs more than having full time technician on staff? I have heard of a particular OCE machine (dont know the brand) that never gives any issues.

**BillyCarpenter** · 10-03-2021, 02:34 AM

Re: best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

Originally posted by reckless

Why is everyone soo big on the maintenance agreement? It costs more than having full time technician on staff? I have heard of a particular OCE machine (dont know the brand) that never gives any issues.

There's many reasons for purchasing a service agreement.

1. End users don't have access to firmware and updates.

2. If a PWB goes out, it can cost you out the arse.

3. Training your employees to repair a copier seems counter-productive. (Don't they have a full time job already?)

and lastly

4. There's no such thing as a copier (OCE or otherwise) that never has issues.

PS - One last thing. A new copier costs a pretty penny and it can go downhill quickly if it's not serviced by an expert.

best monochrome production printer for low cost & reliability

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