C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

[Bob Wescott]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

Pls see my previous statement. we are using C8000 toner without any problem, sometimes we add C8000 developer in toner bottle, but such cases are very rear. I am not suggesting to use C8000 toner for long run, but just to isolate the problem. Why we could not think of it could be manufacturing defect from KM plant. This we have observed such failure wrt xerox developer. Just try for few thousand prints to confirm, as it is cyan dev are failing so whats a big deal in trying.

Here's my crucial question: Has anyone used a compatible DEVELOPER product in a C364 or the like? Are any of them any good? Replacing cyan developer assemblies is awfully costly. We use oem all the way but have obtained maybe a month's use before the developer is half gove again. We bought this unit used with only 100k but some idiot had vacuumed out all 4 developers before returning it to the leasing company. We obtained a set of developers from another relatively young machine and everything was fine until the cyan screwed up, and it has done so now for the 3rd time. We think an HVT board may need replacing but we also have to replace the developer when we do. Does that sound right?

[Bob Wescott]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

My reason for suggesting toner supply is we had a black dev. unit fail. (we thought). On this model there is carrier and toner in the toner bottle. It continuously replenishes the dev unit. It fills a toner hopper and then goes into the dev unit from the hopper. There are a couple of motors that run that process. We had one not working and causing the problem. Good luck.

I think that the black is the only developer that gets replenished this way.

[Lync]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

You guys that are having all the issues with the developer units.
Are you absolutely sure that you haven't got a toner delivery issue? I have had two of these machines now that have had seized Cyan delivery augers. The symptom is C-2551 errors. State confirm indicates toner levels of 1 or 2%.
It appears that toner pushes past the seals in the auger bearing & locks it solid. On one machine it was only the Cyan, but on the other it was Cyan & Magenta.
If you remove the upper cover & the toner bottles you can observe the auger drive rods from the toner delivery motors. If the bearings are seized you will see the drive rods vibrate instead of rotating.
I hope this post is of some assistance.

This is the the exact issue and solution we have had with 3 - 4 machines. (We had the TCR level error) The first thing to do it look at the TCR levels in Service Mode/State Confirmation/Level History1. If they all say zero, do a CMYK half toner at 255 and they will go to the correct read. If you remove the front cover behind the waste toner box with the drum labels on it you will see four white caps on the front of the sub-hopper assembly, these have the auger seals in them and they sometimes get filled with toner behind the seal, and the section just before the dev unit with the auger gets jammed so the motor cannot turn. This seems to happen around 60-80,000 pages for us. If you look at the white caps, you should not be able to see much toner behind it. If you do see a lot of colour it may have broken through the seal. I removed the cap and vacuumed out the toner from the auger, and then vacuumed the toner from underneath the hopper (the section that drops the toner into the dev unit.) and removed most of the toner from the hopper. If you pull out the sub-hopper assembly you can now see if the motor can turn freely behind it by turning the cog with your finger. (Open the bottom flap and hold it over a box so the toner can drop out the bottom of it.) Once you clear the toner and the motor turns, run a few halftones at 255 and make sure the TCR level increases. It should increase by around .5% with each A3 half tone page until it gets back to around 6.5 - 7%. If it doesn't increase by itself manually force toner into the hopper in Manual Toner Add under Image Process Adjustment and try the half tones again. Because the seal has been broken, the likelihood of this happening again is high, so this may be a temporary measure until you replace the seal/cap with a new one, or replace the entire sub-hopper assembly.

Sub-Hopper-Assembly.jpg
(White caps on sub-hopper assembly)

[AjitN]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

How are you sure it's not toner related? Because it's Konica-Minolta toner? There are counterfeits.

This problem occurs -for sure- at the developer units. The magnetic developer roller transfers except the toner the developer too. This is either bias voltages or toner.
All technicians in this thread (total 120 posts in about a year) checked all possible cases. Except the toners. Why some technicians faced many such problems, but others none?
I have seen this same problem for black in a Xerox DC250 copier.

I ask you just do the one minute test to see if the toner cartridge contains developer. May your case is different, almost all others have problem with cyan only.

Pls see my previous statement. we are using C8000 toner without any problem, sometimes we add C8000 developer in toner bottle, but such cases are very rear. I am not suggesting to use C8000 toner for long run, but just to isolate the problem. Why we could not think of it could be manufacturing defect from KM plant. This we have observed such failure wrt xerox developer. Just try for few thousand prints to confirm, as it is cyan dev are failing so whats a big deal in trying.

[EarthKmTech]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

how is the cyan dev unit holding out?

Just logged on, 61169 pages on the cyan dev now - still no problems.

It is a high school so it will be pretty quiet for the rest of the year, serious printing will begin in the new year.

[hotfuser]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

just checked my machine via csrc - 53,000 colour pages printed as of today on last cyan dev unit - I'm happy with that....

way better than the 6k pages i was struggling to get out of them before.

how is the cyan dev unit holding out?

[EarthKmTech]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

just checked my machine via csrc - 53,000 colour pages printed as of today on last cyan dev unit - I'm happy with that....

way better than the 6k pages i was struggling to get out of them before.

[copier tech]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

Failure of Image Unit or Developer Unit.pdf

Not sure if this has been posted on here, maybe of some use.

[hjvolschenk]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

As i started this thread i thought i might let you all know that i am still having the issues with the cyan Dev units 18 months down the line.

Still havent resolved these problems fully but have the work arounds i.e reset the copier back to factory settings and building it back up.

Plus on the copiers with the codes we have changed the bushings and this has fixed that problem.

Yes the c255- codes I agree is not such I a huge issue also had that and the bushings makes sense.The cause of the problem the toner drive section is not supported thight enough causing it to move backwards when tonercartridges is replaced.
Then again i worked on the ricoh product for 10 years and i personally thinkvthe minolta range is a better product...this is a small electronic problem and can be sorted.I ve got c554e in the field on the otherhand that made 508000 copies and I only replaced 2black drums so far.
Lets not give up on this problem and discredit the machine. I mean there is only a 9 percent failure so far....

[tradewynnes2]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

You all should be logging service tickets with Konica Minolta tech support and forcing the issue on to your local Konica service rep. I spoke to mine and he made the mistake of telling me he had this problem and couldn't figure it out and replaced the machine. I couldn't imaging dealing with the same problem for more than a month, much less a year and a half. Force Konica to support the garbage they built or replace it! There is no reason all of you guys at these dealerships, small and large, need to keep wasting incredible amounts of time and money on returning day after day, week after week. That is what they are there for. I work for one of Konica's largest dealerships in the US and they need to come out to these problem machines so they can figure out how engineering went wrong and what everyone needs to do to fix it or they will cause all of us dealers to loose customers to other manufacturers. Fortunately for me, I found the problem with the one machine in my fleet that had the problem, but some of you have several of them, and that is bad for your business to have unhappy customers that have to keep seeing the technicians on an almost daily basis. Come on people, take a stand and make Konica fix their mistake!

[hotfuser]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

As i started this thread i thought i might let you all know that i am still having the issues with the cyan Dev units 18 months down the line.

Still havent resolved these problems fully but have the work arounds i.e reset the copier back to factory settings and building it back up.

Plus on the copiers with the codes we have changed the bushings and this has fixed that problem.

[hjvolschenk]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

How are you sure it's not toner related? Because it's Konica-Minolta toner? There are counterfeits.

This problem occurs -for sure- at the developer units. The magnetic developer roller transfers except the toner the developer too. This is either bias voltages or toner.
All technicians in this thread (total 120 posts in about a year) checked all possible cases. Except the toners. Why some technicians faced many such problems, but others none?
I have seen this same problem for black in a Xerox DC250 copier.

I ask you just do the one minute test to see if the toner cartridge contains developer. May your case is different, almost all others have problem with cyan only.

Its got developer in just tested...like i stated before we only receive original toner from Konica Minolta Inc. themselves...to say that the manufactures(Konica Minolta Japan\Germany) of the product is sending us counterfeit products does not make any sense.
I'll go with bias problem.

[yianni]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

We only allowed to use original Konica Minolta toner and there is not even a way to get hold of pirate toner....i can assure you it is not toner related.

How are you sure it's not toner related? Because it's Konica-Minolta toner? There are counterfeits.

This problem occurs -for sure- at the developer units. The magnetic developer roller transfers except the toner the developer too. This is either bias voltages or toner.
All technicians in this thread (total 120 posts in about a year) checked all possible cases. Except the toners. Why some technicians faced many such problems, but others none?
I have seen this same problem for black in a Xerox DC250 copier.

I ask you just do the one minute test to see if the toner cartridge contains developer. May your case is different, almost all others have problem with cyan only.

[hjvolschenk]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

If you are from one of the branches take it down to the training centre and ask if they can have a look at it.
Did you get any rust and corrosion in the machine. The C360 kicks out its developer if those springs are rusty.

What branch are you from?

I can assure you that it is not rust or corrosion...and i know that it will cause arcing if there was.
And personally I think sending all your problems to head office will only make you lazy...not using your Godly given brain to solve problems.Firstly they train you the basics and from there on out (if your not a parasite or leech sucking the company dry because you are not a real field engineer or to lazy to lift a finger)you take what you have learned and practice it in the field.50% of the time the poor training specialists have to go out and first service the problematic machines before getting to the conclusion that due to poor maintenance the leech or paracite caused the problem...well i am not one of those and like to get hands-on experience trying to use some of my God given talents.
About where i am from ...I see you use the term "RTFM" go read the privacy policy of this site again please...its on a need to know basis and I dont think you need to know!
Please in future , if you don't have any good input rather leave it. There is a few of us that would like to build a brighter future out of this trade to build a legacy or at least a future for our kids teaching them valuable lessons along the way.
Enjoy your day and have a awesome one!
Keep following this thread its going to become an interesting one.

[hjvolschenk]

Re: C224e/C284e/C364e/C454e/C545e cyan dev unit problems

I'm watching this thread carefully. I suspect not original toners. Do this test. Take a magnet and move it at around the surface of toner powder inside the cartridge. You will check if it contains developer powder. Notice this magnet is strong, and also the wall thickness of bottle is thinner than the cartridge. But with any magnet you will see the effect. If it doesn't contain developer for sure it's not original.

[ATTACH]30484[/ATTACH]

We only allowed to use origanal Konica Minolta toner and there is not even a way to get hold of pirate toner....i can asure you it is not toner related.