savin 9965 toner issues

[ender]

I have been having chronic undertonning trouble since I repaired a problem with the charge corona about 2 months ago. This unit is really a Savin 9965 DP. The book I have is for a ricoh 550. I seem to recall when I went to school that the first hour or so was spent fixing errors in the Pubs. Is it possible that I have some misprints in my book?
Here is a list of what seems like relevent settings and values of service program addresses
SP-2209 TONER ADD TIME 900 MG/S
SP-2906 VCONT MAN 10.Ov
SP-2220 VREF 2.52
SP 2223 VT DISPLAY 2.72
SP- 3103 VSG- 3.88
VSP- 1.72
I hope this helps. If someone has time, would you explain the relationships between these settings and values. It would help me understand what is going on. There is only 156K on the dev. It should be ok.

[jprecht]

under toned

There are several possible reasons, for "undertoning" are you saying that on a long run the solids lose density? if copier was fine befor "corona work" that would point you in a drum/chg vs dev/toner issue. agree that dev is prob ok. would look @ chg grid bias if u changed corona. how many hits on drum? are you using oem toner? how many copies bfor density loss? ricohs notorious for ruining dev after over/under toning a couple x. is toner being added properly? what % of fill are you laying down. lets narrow it down to "toner type/ amount, corona work, drum life. mag roller? let me know!!! j

[ender]

thanks

Thanks for replying!
The unit runs aprox 300-400 pages of print 6-10% coverage befor it goes light. It does not call for toner.(no add toner light)
I am using OEM toner I getr from Prosition roller.
The "corona work" was constant sp302-1 codes. charge over current.
I cleand out the drum unit. Drum has aprox 150k. same with dev.cleaned the ID sensor. streched the charge corona springs.
I think I may have changed a sp value or setting on accident.
can you explain what vsg/vsp are and their relationship with vt, vref , and auto process control. I would think I should be able to manually add toner till vt display shows 2.5 and then run dev initalization to get a new referance voltage like my old patch machines from the 80's

[jprecht]

light

ok that helps, am not @ wk with bks 2 look at rite now. precision roller toner is ok. how many x you have "manually toned up?" these boxes notorious for wastin dev. lets think u "stretched" corona springs? is possible you have corona oscillation? swap entire assy if u can. still suspect that you are "not adding enuff" or "losing dev bias ie ck bearing and contact on dv unit (forgot that one) really suspect you changed your "add" conc % somehow. was probably ok till u changed/ajusted mc but now may be pulling 2 much toner and hopper is still adding same, and thus falling behind. will look @ manuals manana am and repost settings you should ck. jp would caution you that digital boxes have many more "variables" for adding toner do not generalize to older analog boxes. thinking you are "losing" toner due to a change in your main chg and/or grid bias. you also need to ck dev bias, we'll talk soon jp

[schooltech]

You currently have 2-209 set at 900 mg/s?

The default setting is 650 mg/s, and with this model (and other models) the higher number actually supplies less toner. I would put it back to the factory spec setting, as maybe the 900 mg/s is the clutch supply 'on' time is not quite enough to handle the density issue.

[jprecht]

lite copy

thats good advice from schooltech. would also ck 3001 id sensor change dev powder and run calib 2801 td initial; then set2209 supply rate to fac default. good luck!~!!! j

[tcs04]

thats good advice from schooltech. would also ck 3001 id sensor change dev powder and run calib 2801 td initial; then set2209 supply rate to fac default. good luck!~!!! j

Also check the drum earth through the shaft bearing and the the condition of the dev bias bearing.

[ccchuah]

The TD ref is too low, usually is 4V. Try force toner until to the required density and execute the TD initial setting (SP2801) in order to set back the ref voltage. The normal reading for the density for Vsp is 1/9 of Vsg reading.

[tcs04]

The TD ref is too low, usually is 4V. Try force toner until to the required density and execute the TD initial setting (SP2801) in order to set back the ref voltage. The normal reading for the density for Vsp is 1/9 of Vsg reading.

Sorry, but Wrong, Wrong and Wrong! see attached

The normal reading for the TD sensor is about 2.5v - 3.0v.

If you force toner you will DECREASE the reading and cause more problems (!)

The normal relationship for the ID patch is Vsp - 1/8 of Vsg (0.5v / 4.0v) and has been for at least 25 years!

The TD reading on your machine is good! the problem is not enough toner being pulled from the Dev unit onto the Drum!

Check the Dev bias and ID patch bias settings (Set to default), Dev bias bearing (In the Frame) and Drum earth!

[imaginemoko]

i pressume that you use from the start same toner as you installed now in the machine.... if not? i suggest clean the toner hopper vaccum it and see if there toner clagging as now its empty set the sp 2209 to 650 mg/s of course the machine now indicate add toner, let the machine recover for its toner level then after its done execute sp 2962...

good luck...

[tcs04]

i pressume that you use from the start same toner as you installed now in the machine.... if not? i suggest clean the toner hopper vaccum it and see if there toner clagging as now its empty set the sp 2209 to 650 mg/s of course the machine now indicate add toner, let the machine recover for its toner level then after its done execute sp 2962...

good luck...

ender is saying that the VT reading is 2.5v which probably means there IS sufficient toner in the Dev Unit, if so the problem is not toner supply as VT is read continuously. The problem seems to have occured since the charge was adjusted (Why was the unit repaired?). The problem must be that either the charge is in correct (too high?) and the laser is not reducing the charge on the image area to make a solid patch / copy, the Dev bias is too "low" (close to zero) which would transfer less toner to the drum, or the drum earth is faulty causing poor laser writing and /or poor process control settings.

It seems the Savin 9965 is the Ricoh AF650 which had a problem with a sing, very small Dev Bias bearing in the frame which used to cause this problem!!.... CHECK THE BEARING!

[tcs04]

P.S.

A quick check for the dev bearing is to pull the dev unit and look for wear and rust on the end of the mag roller shaft.

For the drum earth clip a lead onto the flywheel at the rear and measure the restistance to the copper drum bias terminal. A new bearing will read almost 0 ohms. if the reading is above about 5 ohms and increases when the flywheel is turned change the bearing.

[tcs04]

HOLD ON!!! I thought I'd given this advice before!

You already have a thread running for "Ricoh 550 low toner density"!!!! and are getting almost the same answers as this thread!.... Why not combine the two and save us all some typing??