Ricoh Wireless Card Range

[KenB]

Hi, Gang,

Just wondering...how smoothly have your installations gone using any of the Ricoh, Savin, or Lanier MFPs with wireless? As far as I know, they all use the same card and basic setup, so the specific model shouldn't matter.

It seems as though they won't perform reliably at all with anything under 50%-60% signal strength.

We just did one last Friday, and if the signal went to 45% or less, we would lose connection. We were set up for Wireless-G with WEP encryption.

I remember we had the same situation at a church a few years ago, but worked around it by connecting to a different router in the building. (The pastor had his own for some reason.)

When I put my notebook in the same spot (built in wireless), it worked fine.

We ended up eating the cost of a Access Point to boost the signal to reliable levels. Once I configured the AP as a repeater, we had lots of signal. As a precaution, I created a different SSID, and connected the MFP to it. Added WEP, and life was good.

I'm now considering requiring a mandatory site inspection with a hand held signal tester (about $70) before signing off on a wireless installation. If the signal is below 60%, the customer will be responsible to give us a bit more "oomph" before we'll install.

Thanks!

[KopyKat]

I've had better luck using a third party wireless print server in a lot of my installs...preferably the same brand as the wireless router when possible.

[KenB]

While I am definitely a fan of the wireless print server, there are two problems:

> You lose connection to the WIM and other network "goodies"

and

> Scanning to email or folder is no longer an option. To the best of my knowledge, no RFG machine can scan through the USB port. (Bummer, as that would have helped me out a bunch of times. )

I'm with you on keeping the brands the same across the network, though. You can sometimes get funky little "anomalies" when mixing brands. Plus, devices of the same brand can use some proprietary protocols that help to make them more efficient and reliable.

[KopyKat]

While I am definitely a fan of the wireless print server, there are two problems:

> You lose connection to the WIM and other network "goodies"

and

> Scanning to email or folder is no longer an option. To the best of my knowledge, no RFG machine can scan through the USB port. (Bummer, as that would have helped me out a bunch of times. )

I'm with you on keeping the brands the same across the network, though. You can sometimes get funky little "anomalies" when mixing brands. Plus, devices of the same brand can use some proprietary protocols that help to make them more efficient and reliable.

I use the ones that have an RJ45 port in addition to the USB.

Like this: WGPS606 - NETGEAR.com

[KenB]

OK,

In that case, I guess you really don't need the USB ports. You'll get full functionality from one of the Ethernet ports, so there's no USB needed. (That is, unless there's a benefit to printing through the USB.)

In this environment, you're really using the device as an Access Point.
This is way more cost effective than the cost of a Ricoh wireless card, by the best part of about $200.

It comes down to the age old battle of getting on the same page as your salesreps, as to which wireless option they should go with: the Ricoh card, or the Netgear.

But my main issue still remains: Why is it that a notebook or desktop PC can get along with 20%-30% signal strength, while the Ricoh cards seem to require much more? It's not like they're moving a ton of data.

If the Ricoh cards are going to be that persnickety, maybe it would be best to just go with the AP solution, and save the customer some coin. This way, should he move the machine elsewhere during the course of the lease and wireless isn't used, he'll still have an RJ45 jack to plug into. (From what I know, once the machine has a wireless card installed in it, the RJ45 goes away. That's what my techs tell me, anyway...)

[unisys12]

I've set up two of these wireless bridges this past month. One went smooth as silk, the other... well, I still don't know why it wouldn't work. Maybe was the security they were using on the router was not supported by the bridge, I don't know. I took it back to the shop and it worked great, so... I just made a cable and ran it over to the MFP.

But I agree on the persnicketiness of the Ricoh cards. We have a school with three MFP's configured with the cards and it just so happens that they are also on @Remote. Every day I get a disconnect e-mail, because they are constantly failing off the network and the client has to go in and reboot the machine to get it back up. A real pain the butt if you ask me.

As for the wirless bridge (AP) option, it is actually cheaper and more relieable. So, I have told our sales people that if someone wants to connect wirelessly, that's the way we are going to go. We can charge the customer $125 - $150 (that would cover the cost of the bridge, plus the install/configuration) to connect a wireless bridge, were as the Ricoh cards are around $200+.

Either way though, we still have to make sure that we explain range limitaions, even with a wireless bridge (AP). If not, then you will run into the same problems as the Ricoh wireless cards.

[Jomama46]

I always recommend an AP anymore, not only because they are cheaper than the wireless card but it simplifies the installation. Plus I try to get them to buy and install it and that means when they have a problem with their network, it isnt my problem.

[Vulkor]

See I've had the opposite reaction you guys have had. The Ricoh cards have worked great.

I've used Linksys Wireless Bridges, D-link and Netgear Print Servers and Constant Extreme lag in pings/printing or lots of rebooting. Guess its location location location...


I also do a visual on the range from the router to the copier and building structure if I can before install.

[KenB]

Like Vulkor just said, it truly is location, location, location. However, while a visual inspection is a good start, I think you really need something that can detect the actual strength of the signal. Just because the router is close doesn't mean you're OK. Conversely, a router that seems out of reach may work just fine. There are simply too many variables.

We have a few wireless card installs out there that are just humming away smoothly. Others...not so much.

I am working with our technical contacts at Ricoh to see what their response is.

I'll post any usable information when I hear back.

Thanks,

[Vulkor]

I am working with our technical contacts at Ricoh to see what their response is.

I'll post any usable information when I hear back.

Thanks,

I look forward to your info. I used to take a wireless signal finder, but ya know what.. TOO Many Signals around and it may not be theres.

It is true a visual is not perfect, but if I see a ton of metal and file cabinets and such I'm very leary to recommend wireless.

Sometime you can get a wireless Signal as Poor/Strong and be far away and even connected on a laptop, but still have no throughput. *IE No Internet/ping*

Yeah so I put the laptop where the MFP would be and see Signal strength. If not nearly 70% I often times suggest wiring it. Especially if they print a lot of graphics or plan on scanning a lot.

[KenB]

Some of the detectors I found will show the SSIDs they find, along with whether encryption is used or not. (The SSIDs will appear in order of decreasing signal strength.)

You can get a little crazy, and spend around $400 on one that will give you more info than you'll ever need, but I don't think that too many service managers would go for that. That may be different if you do a BUNCH of wireless, I suppose. (Of course, you could always invest in a Fluke or the like, and drop about $6k on one. )

I totally agree on the getting connected and not getting any usability, though.

As you mentioned, it's a good idea to put your notebook in the MFP's place and give it a shot for full functionality.

Maybe the notebook AND a tester would be the best solution. The signal strength meter in Windoze leaves a bit to be desired, at best. If there are any applications that help with this, I'd love to check 'em out.

Some info that I've picked up on so far (not directly from Ricoh):

1). I stand corrected on my earlier post. There are actually several models of cards used, not just one.

2). There may be interference coming from other 2.4GHz devices in the area that will cause the MFPs to lose connection, such as cordless phones.

3). As always, make sure that all firmware us current. (The MP4000 / 5000 NIB v.7.23 flash addresses wireless issues.

So much for now...

[Jomama46]

I have NetStumbler loaded on my laptop and it works pretty good for a free ap. It shows all the SSIDs in the area and the strength of each.
Its worth a try for the price.

I found a network down the street from our place and it was completely unprotected. It was a real estate place and I was able to access his files. Scary. I went down and told them that I stumbled on it and maybe they would like to fix that.

He told me it was improbable as he had paid several hundred dollars for someone to set up his network. (turns out it was his 20 something son,) So I said OK and left.
I checked it the next weekend and it was secure. hehe

[nmfaxman]

I usually install a wireless gaming adapter that supports WPA security and hook up a Cat5 cable long enough so I can place it anywhere I need to keep a strong signal.

[Vulkor]

2). There may be interference coming from other 2.4GHz devices in the area that will cause the MFPs to lose connection, such as cordless phones.

.

Yeah a Major problem at some of my customers.. These 2.4Ghz phones. I've proved to them by pulling out the batteries and suddenly it all works great.

As Jomama46 says.. Netstumbler works pretty good. It was actually built into my Dell Studio 1705.

[KenB]

I checked out NetStumbler. I had forgotten that I used it for wired "stuff" a few years ago.

While definitely not at all bad for freeware, I have found a few very inexpensive apps (around $40) that provide much more info.

Be careful if you check any of these "cheapware" ones out, though. I installed two of them (foolishly at the same time), and my wireless card stopped working due to the additional drivers that got installed.

I needed to delete all the drivers for my (Intel) wireless, and have Windoze rediscover it. Not a lot of fun...

I normally try to test software in a Microsoft Virtual PC session, but I doubt that any app that needs to integrate directly with hardware would work properly in a virtual world.

Thanks!