HP never thought of the J00 jam.

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  • blackcat4866
    Master Of The Obvious

    Site Contributor
    10,000+ Posts
    • Jul 2007
    • 23008
    #1

    HP never thought of the J00 jam.

    Ok, this requires a little explanation. If you get a jam in a Kyocera then power Off/On, you get a non-specific J00 jam. That means that one or more of the paper sensors are blocked, you'll have to figure out which ones. You're probably thinking: I know he's got a point, so get to it.

    This HP is a filthy Laserjet 4100 in a factory, mostly indistinguishable from a pile of dirt. I could fill in the problem for all service calls in advance: "jamming", though in this case it never actually jammed.

    Symptoms:
    When attempting to print an internal report, the machine displays "TRAY 1 LOAD PLAIN LETTER". When you press GO it displays "USE EXEC TRAY 2?". When you press GO again it prints an image 13mm narrower and 6mm shorter than letter, then displays "41.03 UNEXPECTED PAPER SIZE".

    Sounds simple right? Check the paper size switches and the bottom two, SW601 and SW602, and sure enough they close only to 90 ohms. So I bring back the board and solder in two mostly newer switches that close to 0 ohms. With a little tweaking on the metal levers, and it displays LETTER paper every time. You can imagine my disappointment when I print a report, and again I get "41.03 UNEXPECTED PAPER SIZE". How can that be? It wants letter. It gets letter. So what's the problem? To add to the confusion, the actual error as recorded on the error log is:
    41.03.00 ?.? UNEXPECTED PAPER SIZE LOAD TRAY 0 VELLUM ?
    Tray 0? Vellum? wtf?

    The problem is that the registration switch is completely buried in toner. The formatter is expecting to see the switch change state at the trail edge, and it can't. The machine boots up fine with blocked sensors, and the only time it checks that sensor is when the paper is supposed to pass. Then instead of jamming, it passes the paper anyway. What this machine really needs is a J00 jam during initialization.

    Another weird thing is that the engine tests also pass, even when sensors are blocked. Perhaps the jam detection is temporarily shut off. Can anybody confirm that? =^..^=
    If you'd like a serious answer to your request:
    1) demonstrate that you've read the manual
    2) demonstrate that you made some attempt to fix it.
    3) if you're going to ask about jams include the jam code.
    4) if you're going to ask about an error code include the error code.
    5) You are the person onsite. Only you can make observations.

    blackcat: Master Of The Obvious =^..^=
    Tags: None
    • prntrfxr
      Service Manager

      1,000+ Posts
      • Apr 2008
      • 1622
      #2
      Re: HP never thought of the J00 jam.

      The problems with jamming in the 4000/4100 series printers:

      If it gives you "TRAY 1 LOAD PLAIN LETTER":
      1. Make sure tray 1 is closed.
      2. Check the configuration page to see what the printer thinks it has loaded in the trays.
      3. Check tray 1 sensor flag to make sure it's not broken/missing.
      4. Check paper tray guides and paper stop. 4000 trays especially because the paper stops get broken, come apart, or the spring gets loose.
      5. Change paper size board. (we still sell quite a few of these)
      6. Replace the engine control board

      Paper not coming out of the tray:
      1. Run paper path tests (10 pages) and watch from the rear of the tray.
      2. If the 4 d-shaped pick up rollers do not attempt to turn, replace the tray 2 p/u asm or the solenoid. (I would probably replace the assembly due to the age of the printer and likely wearing on gears.)
      3. If the paper gets picked and then falls back into the tray, replace the feed/separation rollers (2) and the torque limiter in the tray.
      4. If problem 3 still exists, remove tray 1 and clear paper/label debris in the path of the paper feed asm and the back of the tray 1 assembly. Anything here will prevent paper or retard paper movement. While you're in here it is a good time to blow out the registration sensor, since you can see it. Replace the paper feed asm as needed (this part is now discontinued from HP and the rollers from Canon are no longer available - best bet to get client to upgrade machine.)
      5. Replace the Registration Sensor Asm
      6. Replace the Engine control board

      Paper jamming at the registration asm.
      1. Perform step 4 of the previous list
      2. Replace registration asm (this part is now discontinued from HP and the rollers from Canon are no longer available - best bet to get client to upgrade machine.)

      Paper jamming under the cartridge
      1. Replace toner cartridge.
      2. Check registration asm (see previous problem)
      3. Is paper stopping at fuser? Disconnect toner door linkage, remove cartridge, move linkage and make sure gear drive engages fuser. Replace fuser as needed.

      Paper jamming in fuser
      1. Test with rear door open. Does the problem still occur? If yes, go to 2. If no go to 3.
      2. Replace fuser
      3. Check rear door for damage. Make sure actuator on fuser is not damaged, door trips this to allow paper to go through delivery asm. Replace fuser or door as needed.
      4. Replace delivery asm

      DC controller and power supply are all in one board: Engine Control Board. So if everything else is tried, that's your problem. Due to the age on these machines it can just as easily be that as anything else.
      Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Coke in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO-HOO, what a ride!".

        Comment

        • Setright
          FSS / SPM

          100+ Posts
          • Nov 2008
          • 247
          #3
          Re: HP never thought of the J00 jam.

          Cannot comment on this case directly, since it's 6 years since I last touched an HP printer.

          Still..it made me think of the error code 79.00 that I once fought with (from my memory)

          Looked it up...the HP manual said "An error occurred"

            Comment

            • blackcat4866
              Master Of The Obvious

              Site Contributor
              10,000+ Posts
              • Jul 2007
              • 23008
              #4
              Re: HP never thought of the J00 jam.

              Originally posted by blackcat4866
              ... Sounds simple right? Check the paper size switches and the bottom two, SW601 and SW602, and sure enough they close only to 90 ohms. So I bring back the board and solder in two mostly newer switches that close to 0 ohms. With a little tweaking on the metal levers, and it displays LETTER paper every time. You can imagine my disappointment when I print a report, and again I get "41.03 UNEXPECTED PAPER SIZE". How can that be? It wants letter. It gets letter. So what's the problem? To add to the confusion, the actual error as recorded on the error log is:
              41.03.00 ?.? UNEXPECTED PAPER SIZE LOAD TRAY 0 VELLUM ?
              Tray 0? Vellum? wtf?

              ... Another weird thing is that the engine tests also pass, even when sensors are blocked. Perhaps the jam detection is temporarily shut off. Can anybody confirm that? =^..^=
              Thanks prntrfxr for a very detailed answer, but I think you missed the questions. Perhaps I buried them too deeply is the commentary.

              1) What does: 41.03.00 ?.? UNEXPECTED PAPER SIZE LOAD TRAY 0 VELLUM ? have to do with a stationary jam at the registration sensor?

              2) Is jam detection disabled for engine test prints? Why would paper pass a blocked reg sensor?
              If you'd like a serious answer to your request:
              1) demonstrate that you've read the manual
              2) demonstrate that you made some attempt to fix it.
              3) if you're going to ask about jams include the jam code.
              4) if you're going to ask about an error code include the error code.
              5) You are the person onsite. Only you can make observations.

              blackcat: Master Of The Obvious =^..^=

                Comment

                • Chameleon
                  Trusted Tech

                  100+ Posts
                  • Nov 2011
                  • 200
                  #5
                  Re: HP never thought of the J00 jam.

                  I can sympathize. I had a call for "can't print" on a hp 9050, but unkown to me there was a chunk of paper blocking the reg sensor. It would boot up and say "Ready" the stinking liar. Nothing would print. It would act as if it was going to print something but just hang indefinitly. My engine test failed to print. The only clue I had was Once or twice it showed a fuser jam when booting up but open/close the door and the jam went away. I was more focused on the can't print and failing engine test for it to occur to me I had a blocked sensor. There was another 9050 right next to it so I tried swapping the boards, fuser, laser and still same issue. Then I had the fuser jam again and thought to check all the sensors and found the piece of paper. Felt like a rookie but if HP had the J00 jam it would have saved me a lot of time.
                  The chance that higher life forms might have emerged in this way is comparable to the chance that a tornado sweeping through a junkyard might assemble a Boeing 747 from the materials therein. -Fred Hoyle

                    Comment

                    • blackcat4866
                      Master Of The Obvious

                      Site Contributor
                      10,000+ Posts
                      • Jul 2007
                      • 23008
                      #6
                      Re: HP never thought of the J00 jam.

                      Originally posted by Chameleon
                      I can sympathize. I had a call for "can't print" on a hp 9050, but unknown to me there was a chunk of paper blocking the reg sensor. It would boot up and say "Ready" the stinking liar. ... Felt like a rookie but if HP had the J00 jam it would have saved me a lot of time.
                      That's what I'm talking about. This could have been really easy to diagnose with one additional jam code ... and I feel like an idiot for not getting there quicker. =^..^=
                      If you'd like a serious answer to your request:
                      1) demonstrate that you've read the manual
                      2) demonstrate that you made some attempt to fix it.
                      3) if you're going to ask about jams include the jam code.
                      4) if you're going to ask about an error code include the error code.
                      5) You are the person onsite. Only you can make observations.

                      blackcat: Master Of The Obvious =^..^=

                        Comment

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