canon ir 4570 fax dead

[pjdbm]

Earlier this week I went out on this machine for blank display, after removing all connectors on all boards in back and still had issues I exposed the display harness and cut all the tie wraps and the machine seems to be fixed. (I came to the conclusion it was a pinch wire because if i slapped the right side of machine the display came back)

That issue is resolved, they call back a few days later and say their fax is not working, went back today and sure enough the fax modem is dead.

I took out the fax board and reseat all connections and did not smell or see anything burnt. put it all back together and still dead.

I gave them a loaner fax machine

Is it not uncommon for fax boards to blow on these? I heard they are pretty robust.

Could this be a dc controller?

any help will be appreciated
Thanks

[teckat]

Did u check the ERROR LOG /

did customer slap the same spot when it went dead ??

not a DC pcb issue, because loaner fax is working

what wires are located behind slap area ???

[pjdbm]

Hi teckat


I did not check error log but I was the one that slapped the right side. The only wire harness that runs across the top was the yellow display harness.

I have to go back Monday with a fax board and dc controller, odd that it all happen at the same time. The only thing I did was reseat every harness connection .

[pjdbm]

Fax Modem board was the problem, installed new one and she is up and running

thanks teckat

[blackcat4866]

Congratulations. I have had very few circuit board problems with Canon fax. It's usually print engine or ADF problems. =^..^=

[pjdbm]

I suspect a phone line voltages but cant prove it. I should have a surge on that line for fax.

[teckat]

Surge protector is OK to use,
Never use those Aux Back up power supplies, they create line noise, false errors, & headaches -
any customer that calls with weird issues and has one of those attached-we remove them > issue solved 90% of the time, other times it's improper outlet Grounding-
I know it's expensive, but we now require all new contracts & re-newels to have a Dedicated Line for their machines or they can look for another Service Provider

[pjdbm]

On all my new installs I put a ESP surge protector line conditioner, I have it covering the Ethernet/AC and fax.

I dont know, why invite an issue , I just add it to cost of purchase.

[teckat]

Our bottom Line is u install Dedicated Line/ or Look Elsewhere

Nothing protects against Lightning / or Full Power Surge after a Major Blackout/
NYC/NYS has already experienced such an Issue

[blackcat4866]

Phone Line Tester

Build yourself a simple phone line tester. ~ Total Cost $35.00
Attach a D'Arsonval movement VOM to the back of a fax handset. wire the input=female RJ11 red & green wires to a DPDT switch (to reverse the polarity), then to the VOM/handset. This is not terribly high tech, but you can identify a really bad, out of specs phone line.

Plug the phone cord into your new tester. Check these voltages:

On Hook: -48 VDC (-42.5 to -56.5 VDC), 90 VAC
Off Hook: -10 VDC (-8 to -12 VDC), 8 VAC
Ringing: peak 125 VAC (110 to 137 VAC)

The polarity only matters so that your meter will deflect the correct direction. All modern faxes correct their own polarity.

If the line is out of specs, check the same voltages at the demarc (where the phone line comes into the building). If voltages are still out of specs, its the local telephone provider. If its OK at the demarc, you can be sure its the PBx.

It sounds complicated, but with the tester and a little practice you'll be out of there in 10 minutes with proof it's not your machine. That can be hard to come by.

You'll spend $200 or more for a commercial tester with these same features.

[pjdbm]

pretty cool stuff, I need to look into this. I just have the basic tester that sees reversed and ground. I have a phone line testing kit too so it would be a real nice compliment to my existing kit.

[teckat]

pretty cool stuff, I need to look into this. I just have the basic tester that sees reversed and ground. I have a phone line testing kit too so it would be a real nice compliment to my existing kit.

1] Complete Tool Kit: In addition to the basic tools (pliers, screw drivers, volt meter, etc) a good tool kit should also have an analog telephone (DTMF handset with dialer). The phone may be used accordingly:

-- To check that the fax line is working / functional.

-- To check for noise (humming, popping, clicking, static, etc.). Always have the customer listen to the noise. It is their responsibility to provide a noise-free, error-free channel.

-- To check for long distance and international dialing access (newly installed lines may not be programmed correctly).
-- To check for Pin Code access (not every operator is familiar with the required dialing sequences).

2] Telephone Line Voltages: Fax machines communicate over single line phone networks where the 'Ring' and 'Tip' voltages are always located across the two center terminals. Line voltages are checked accordingly:

on-hook voltage (phone is hung up)
--set the volt meter to 200 vdc
--should read within the 48vdc ~ 52vdc range

off-hook voltage (phone is off-hook and dial tone is generated)
--set the volt meter to 200 vdc
--should read within the 8 vdc ~ 12 vdc range

ringing voltage (incoming call)
--set the volt meter to 200 vac
--should read within the 75 vac ~ 105 vac range

3] RJ11-C Modular jack: Testing phone line voltages can be difficult if not impossible at times unless you can establish a really good connection to the phone line. The RJ11-C box can be used to establish a good connection.

--RJ11-C box with two female connectors (remove the cover and test with your meter across the red and green terminals). An additional phone cable is required.

--RJ11-C box with one male and one female connector; remove the cover and test with your meter across the red and green terminals).

4] Line Test Chart: This is usually requested by the technical support center when a Line Test is requested, or suggested. It may be any single-page document that has a lot of background, such that the transmission time exceeds two minutes.

5] Be a good Observant: To detect additional equipment that may be connected to the line.

6] Listen Carefully: To detect unusual and additional connected devices or conversations on the fax line
.
7] Familiarity with fax modem signaling: This is helpful when determining if the responding modem is a fax or PC data modem.