C450 Paper Size Detection

[Wappla]

A simple one for the beginning, …
Our aging C450 has several problems with the automatic paper size detection. Caring about the Paper Size Sensors or even replacing the Paper Size Boards is too much for the moment. So I thought there might be a possibility to activate a manual paper size selection like for tray 1 also for tray 2, 3 + 4. I could'nt find anything in the field service manual about it. Is there a possibility or did KM just make it impossible to select a paper size for the lower trays, like at newer machines?

[copyman]

You can lock the trays for any type or size. Look in the user settings or admin settings. It wouldn't be in the service manual.

[Wappla]

If I am not completely blind, there is nothing. Not in user- nor admin settings. In every case I went again through the printing manual as well and there for sure is only the possibility to specify trays if the printer driver did not specify anything.
It might be that it is connected to my Fiery, as the menue -> user settings-> printer is missing (compared to the printing manual)?
As well I went through the admin settings, and did as well not find a possibility for locking the papersize of the trays 2–4. Tray 1 has the usual size selection in user mode, …

[Synthohol]

are you using the fiery driver? is it set to LPR port 515 and bi-directional is checked in the driver itself with the fiery IP in the box?
image.png
walk me through it, you put what paper type/size in the tray and the screen says a different size?
the machine is a dinosaur and i dont recall every screen from memory. can you post pics of the LCD? when you select a tray isnt there a button next to it to change the size/type manually.
c450.jpg

[copyman]

I assumed you meant the C450i not the old C450 that has to be at least 30 yrs old! Not sure Fiery was even around back then?

[Synthohol]

12.jpg 13.jpg
it was...
IC-402 i think
i had a bunch of c450p and c450s id calibrate the fierys all the time.
i feel like the last of the Mohicans being able to calibrate the older stuff with this relic!!

the 402 may have used the es-1000 though. i had so many c3102/2002s i use the x-rite on. those were the days!

[KMFLT3CH]

C450.... blast from the past!

[copyman]

12.jpg 13.jpg
it was...
IC-402 i think
i had a bunch of c450p and c450s id calibrate the fierys all the time.
i feel like the last of the Mohicans being able to calibrate the older stuff with this relic!!

the 402 may have used the es-1000 though. i had so many c3102/2002s i use the x-rite on. those were the days!

Ouch! That pic was painful to look at You old fart!

[Wappla]

Yes it is the IC-402 Fiery. I am using this X3e with the X3eTY 35C-KM PS v2.01 drivers. The Firy is hooked up to a G5 via Bonjour.

And what agism against my C450, it is getting 20 years old in a few months not 30!

OK, about the problem, see the pictures. The complete section "paper size" like for tray 1 and bypass is missing for tray 2 – 4. The Paper Size Sensors or the Paper Size Boards seem to act randomely. Putting in some A3 paper might lead to A4, A3, Letter, 8 x 16 detection, without any chance to set the size manually, …

tray1.jpg

tray2.jpg

[Synthohol]

memory is starting to come back, the inner metal trays used to slide back when slamming the tray shut with a full ream.
take out the paper and look at the oval holes that attach the guides to the plastic of the tray. should be hash marks on one of them.
id take letter landscape in the tray and line it up with the width sticker for 8 1/2 and see if its far off.
sometimes they only need just a hair adjustment to start showing the correct sizes.
if its the old style i remember there are 4 "fingers" the tray size configures in the back, sometimes they get bent too.
man i miss weird stuff like this.
also just a side note, why not use IP/LPR port instead of bonjour. especially the 2 way communication connection. just curious.

this puppy takes a beating and the buttons get dirty.
22.jpg

[Wappla]

take out … look at … sometimes they only need just a hair adjustment to start showing the correct sizes.

OK, you got me, I will have a look this weekend.

Anyways I'd like to know if there is a software option to change the tray settings manually?

if its the old style i remember there are 4 "fingers" the tray size configures in the back, sometimes they get bent too.

Yes, that is what I read in the sm and thought, let's ask for the software first.

man i miss weird stuff like this.

I have more of this kind! Stay tuned.

also just a side note, why not use IP/LPR port instead of bonjour. especially the 2 way communication connection. just curious.

Just because I am not aware about the exact differences, … thought it is just how the connection is established. Plus, I also never had enough time to configure our network with fixed IPs, for all machines/computers :-/

[Synthohol]

Roger that!
will stay tuned
do you have command workstation?
if you assign an IP to it you can go to the fierys web page and download drivers and software right from the fiery itself, didnt know if you knew.
may need an old browser though, its likely not an https friendly site because of its age.
i really hope its that easy, i had more than my share of users bowling for strikes when they close the tray
good luck!
i didnt see anything that lets you manually set sizes for other trays and there are not even bit switches to tinker with.

[Wappla]

Well, I tried my best without success. I slipped out tray 2. Started to adjust the gears to the marks at the plastic inside the tray, like you suggested. Though it was a little bit tricky for me, to get the gear with the screw inside, in place, because of the - let me call ist - metal "paper lift plate" which was in the way. They were off about 1mm indeed.
Also I tried to bend the Lever ("fingers" "22" in your sketch above) in direction of the tray, so that it is switching correctly.
No success, the tray is detecting randomely any paper size, independentely from the paper that is loaded :-(
So I am starting to ask myselve if the Paper Size Board went crazy, instead of a mechanical problem? But I doubt that all 4 of the paper size board start to detect more an more inaccurate with every 6 months at the same time, …

Regarding your question about command workstation, no I do not. We get our machines mainly as leasing returns, so without original discs. I nevertheless would need an old version for Mac OS 10.4.11 that efi does not provide anymore. And yes, I know about the download possibilities. BTW that reminder brought up 2 more issues for me. I have bigger network problem plus there are submenues at the firey that need a password I do not know, …

EDIT: and thanks for clearing my initial question, that there really is nothing that lets you manually set sizes for other trays than 1.

[Synthohol]

Fiery.1 is the pass.

VII. Specifying the Controller Settings

Specify the default settings for the controller.

1. Turn on the controller.

2. Turn on the copier.

3. [Language Setup] appears in the lower-left corner

of the screen in the copier’s touch panel.

4. Press the [Utility/Counter] key on the copier.

5. Touch [Controller Details].

Note:

If [Controller Details] does not appear, wait a short while, and then repeat steps 3 and 4.

6. In the Language Setup screen, select the language and market region.

After the settings have been specified, the controller restarts.

7. When the password is entered, the Setup screen

appears. The default password is “Fiery.1”. (Be

sure to type in the password with the correct capitalization.)

8. The Setup screen appears in the controller operation panel.

9. Touch [Server Setup].

10.Without specifying any other settings, touch [Exit]. When “Save Changes” appears, select “Yes”.

11.In the same way, select “Network Setup”, “Protocol Setup”, “TCP/IP Setup”, then “Ethernet Setup”, and then set “Enable TCP/IP for Ethernet” to “Yes” and “Enable Auto IP Configration” to “No”.

[Wappla]

Thanks Synthohol, Fiery setup worked well, pass was the standard, and network is under control. I tried now to hook up the C450 as TCP/IP printer, but that leads to an extreme slow "LPD spooling" when sending a printjob. And I mean about 4 seconds per page (you can see the counting in the printer queue), while via Bonjour 150 pages are sent in 2 seconds, …
My earlier "tray tries" changed something. Paper size detection is now better, not reliable, but every 4th tray shut the correct one is detected.