The Much Maligned MP4000/5000

[Llama God]

I went to look at a jamming problem on an MP5000 today and, for a change, I'd like to say something positive.

It had the new dev unit with the coated mag roller and a PCU installed, under warranty, at roughly 240k after much buggering about with temporary mods and more devs than I care to remember. It then had a drum and blade (not done by me, I hasten to add) at 420k.

Today, having churned out some 469k, the machine has eventually decided that it would like a fuser and transfer service and the copy quality is smart as a dart. It's had a web or two of course, and what a job they are, but I can't grumble at that.

Despite the PM cycle being 160k, can I be the first (and maybe last) to say that these machines aren't always the piles of turd which they're made out to be? Ok, we had all sorts of problems with them shortly after launch but, touchwood, maybe the worst is over. Any machine which can treble its PM cycle on fuser parts can't be all bad, can it?

[Shadow1]

Any machine which can treble its PM cycle on fuser parts can't be all bad, can it?

I think you may stand alone on this one until after they fix the toner/developer problem.

I will grant you the fuser life is very good for this size machine, but the web assembly design??? C'mon - my dog could do better than that. and the transfer case design is o.k. if you disable the overflow sensor, which is annother sore point with me.

Actually, I do kind of agree with you - the problem is not with the design of the machine, but with the engineers who refuse to recognize and correct the obvious toner problem. And I don't buy the "it's not easy being green" excuse for not fixing the toner - how green is it to keep replacing developer after only 10% of its rated life???

[Llama God]

I think you must have misunderstood regarding the web design - I was saying that it's a crock of shite.

[df3036]

Going to try this

Haven't installed yet but....

MP4000-8200-web-mod 004.jpg

MP4000-8200-web-mod 003.jpg

Using AE040051 oil roller from Aficio 1055/ FT7900 series.
Have to end for end the one way bearing on the oil roller. Even if it does not last as long, it is way easier to change.

Any thoughts?
Dave

[Kopyrtek]

Nice shots there df3036.They do look the same in the pics.Have to check into that myself.Get back to you soon

[df3036]

I just added the oil roller to an existing MP4000 oil unit. Removed the excess gears etc...

[Kopyrtek]

Llama god...you are by yourself on this one.The engineers SHOULD gotten smart after the 2035 and 3035 series about the toner issues but didnt.With all the toner going into the drum unit and only grey copies coming out the fuser should last quite a while.

[Llama God]

You know I hadn't thought of it like that!

[unisys12]

I just added the oil roller to an existing MP4000 oil unit. Removed the excess gears etc...

One question on this though... What will actually clean the hot roller? Usually there's a cleaning roller located behind the oil roller that collects trash off the oil roller. Without that, would that trash do one of two things; 1) be reapplied to the hot roller, or 2) become adhered to the oil roller, which in turn blocks the oil on that area.

I'm not knocking the mod, by no means. I think anything is better than that mad gab garble of crap on the machine now. I mean, even worse case scenario, why couldn't they have at least carried over the web assembly from the B246? Sure it's wider, but how much money do you think was spent designing the unit on this machine now and compare that to how much it would have cost to hold the B246 unit up to the D009 fuser and say, "Ok fellas! Shrink it down this much!"


Sorry... I just had a Charlie Brown moment.

[Shadow1]

I suppose the oil roller / cleaning roller combo bushing is too big to fit in there to add the cleaning roller and make it a perfect mod, but this is certainly worth a try like it is - Great Idea!

Llama God:
I think you misinterpreted my misinterpretation - I was saying I agree the fuser life is impressive, but the design still sux.

[rthonpm]

I just replaced a pressure roller in one of these yesterday at about 489,000 clicks. Heat tube looks like it's almost brand new. If the web assembly is a nightmare of overengineering, then the disassembly of the fuser to get to either of the rollers is worse. Too many different types of screws and too many tight corners to fit into.
For the lousy web, I have a complete web in the box ready to go thanks to a fused set screw on the first one I did. Now I just swap out the one needing replacement with the complete one and then rebuild at my leisure in the office or in a controlled environment. It makes it a lot easier than trying to pry off E-clips in a customer's office or on a table with a floor that somehow always seems to hide those clips when they fall!
I also did my first updated developer unit about three weeks ago, on the same machine no less, and it still has pretty good copy quality. I hope once the new toner makes its way out to customer sites that it will also improve the output. I'm beginning to think though that Ricoh is 'Chinese Democracy-ing' us on this toner: it will be out at some point in the next fifteen years right?

[Shadow1]

Check the cost on the entire web assembly - for us the difference in price is not worth the time to have a tech rebuild it given our load rating. A lot of them have to be replaced anyway because of the screwy set screws. Hopefully the replacements have been updated, but its not really an issue for us. You should also go into sp1902 and crank up the drive interval and crank down the drive time I been experimenting around 15 and 1.5 - really extends the life of the web, still runs clean, and the darn thing stays lubed with all that wax in the puked toner anyway...

[df3036]

The cleaning roller and bushings from the 1055 are too big. No room to add the springs. Going back, we did run one of the analog machines minus the cleaning roller and that self stick blade they had and those were 55/70 cpm machines. The press cleaning roller should be up to it though. Add to that the previous 35/45 series has had no hot roller cleaning at all. I do like the web timing choice as well, the webs are not that dirty anyhow (imagine that).

[Ltd]

I went to look at a jamming problem on an MP5000 today and, for a change, I'd like to say something positive.

It had the new dev unit with the coated mag roller and a PCU installed, under warranty, at roughly 240k after much buggering about with temporary mods and more devs than I care to remember. It then had a drum and blade (not done by me, I hasten to add) at 420k.

Today, having churned out some 469k, the machine has eventually decided that it would like a fuser and transfer service and the copy quality is smart as a dart. It's had a web or two of course, and what a job they are, but I can't grumble at that.

Despite the PM cycle being 160k, can I be the first (and maybe last) to say that these machines aren't always the piles of turd which they're made out to be? Ok, we had all sorts of problems with them shortly after launch but, touchwood, maybe the worst is over. Any machine which can treble its PM cycle on fuser parts can't be all bad, can it?

I had one MP4000 ran from new to 149985 copies for the 1 st service call : Fuser web call. I go ahead do PM, when I open the drum. I am supprised because the drum unit so cleaned, 2 white gear inside barely dirty.Copy quality fair. Mag roller ofcourse coated with black wax. all SP are at default.

[zico21]

For what it's worth, we ordered MP4500 toner yesterday and there is now a new number, 841346 (old # 884922). Since the MP35000/4500 has the same toner issues as the MP4000/5000 I thought I'd post here. I don't know anything more at this point other than there is a new number.