Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

As an FYI, Global Warming is a subset of Climate change. There are many factors that need to be aggregated to form an informed opinion on climate change.

If you take the time to read this Wikipedia definition, you will realize that snap personal decisions on whether global climate change is real or not does not give the topic fair consideration.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change

An accurate recording of global temperature began in 1880. 2015 was the warmest year that NASA ever recorded. 2016 proved to be even warmer. As the temperature warms and the oceans absorb more carbon dioxide, it stores more energy. Eventually this energy has to be released with violent hurricanes and cyclones. If global temperatures continue to rise as predicted, unless mankind changes it ways, such as proposed under the Paris Agreement, the peaceful future of coastal communities increases in peril.

[gneebore]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Sorry, Greenbore, you seem to have me confused with someone else. theengle and I were discussing the ozone layer, not global warming.
Plus, I haven't mentioned anything about Ohio. In this post or any other. If I have, please direct me to it and I will beg for your forgiveness.

You are quite correct. Six months ago it was salesservice guy that posted the Ohio figures as proof of global warming. There were quite few other posts about global warming and the back and forth concerning the subject.

[theengel]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

I am not trying to be confrontational, but I have been unable to find any information concerning the ozone layer and heating of the earth. The depletion of the ozone layer is pretty well documented, and since the banning of CFCs the hole over Antarctica has stopped growing.

https://www.nasa.gov/content/goddard...the-ozone-hole

https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/blogs/climateqa/are-the-ozone-hole-and-global-warming-related/

Men are paid to sit and come up with this crap. I mean, that's their jobs--to make reality fit their theories. The further you dig into this, the more layers of contradiction you find. Like peeling an onion, speculation upon speculation upon outdated theory upon unreviewed and unproven crap. But it always boils down to this: everyone needs to start buying this product instead of that one.

In the end, all of it is about money and power.

[theengel]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

You are quite correct. Six months ago it was salesservice guy that posted the Ohio figures as proof of global warming. There were quite few other posts about global warming and the back and forth concerning the subject.

I remember that. To tell you the truth, we've had relatively mild winters and summers here in Ohio. Although, I'm only going by memory.

[gneebore]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

I remember that. To tell you the truth, we've had relatively mild winters and summers here in Ohio. Although, I'm only going by memory.

And like a lot of people have pointed out everywhere there are record warm years and record cool years everywhere. There are some people that have actually blamed record cold waves on global warming. they chatter along the lines of: "well the lower equatorial regions are so much hotter now the air heats and rises so the colder polar air which is heavier then flows towards the equator to cause the record lower temperatures".
Yes record cold is caused by global warming or as they prefer to say now "climate change." Funny thing is none of the fanatics on global warming have any answer for the historic ice ages. And the very real historic documents that have documented the Hudson River freezing over. Oh yes it was last frozen over in 2015.

[ZOOTECH]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Well, the historic ice ages happened way before mankind starting polluting the atmosphere; and eliminating the forests through advancing civilization for increased farmland, and cities will accelerate the dismise of Earth as we know it.
Like it or not, we might be in a 'cyclical' period of warm weather, but if we don't take it seriously, and make corrections, we as humans will be (wait for it) toast.
Go ahead and slam me for my 'feelings' of what might happen; I don't have children of my own, but I do worry about Nephews, Nieces, and their children (and all mankind).

[gneebore]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Well, the historic ice ages happened way before mankind starting polluting the atmosphere; and eliminating the forests through advancing civilization for increased farmland, and cities will accelerate the dismise of Earth as we know it.
Like it or not, we might be in a 'cyclical' period of warm weather, but if we don't take it seriously, and make corrections, we as humans will be (wait for it) toast.
Go ahead and slam me for my 'feelings' of what might happen; I don't have children of my own, but I do worry about Nephews, Nieces, and their children (and all mankind).

Again there maybe localized effects in some cases. But on a global level with catastrophic results in within the life span of your nieces and nephews or even their children nope None of the effects in early 21st century predicted by the global warming community in the late 80/early 90's has come to pass. Just for example the complete melting of the Arctic ice. Or even the three feet higher tides(most common effect mentioned but some of up to 20 feet) that would swamp low lying coastal areas.

Instead we do have information that the IPCC ignored any data that contradicted their preconceived notion of man made global warming. Reading the article it is interesting to note when explaining the temperature increase in the Antartic the IPCC used a formula of their own to guesstimate the temperature across the continent where there was none. NASA satellite records show in the same period a one degree lower temperature.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/rec.equestrian/aAvMGFX7BiY/lM_Se8d8IPQJ

[theengel]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Don't get me wrong. I despise the industrial pollution that's happening. As much as I love capitalism, I realize something has to be done. And I understand that the only reason America is so clean is because we've outsourced all the dirty work to places where there aren't as many regulations... as well as slave labor.

But man made climate change? That's just stretching things.

[Copier Addict]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/bl...rming-related/



Men are paid to sit and come up with this crap. I mean, that's their jobs--to make reality fit their theories. The further you dig into this, the more layers of contradiction you find. Like peeling an onion, speculation upon speculation upon outdated theory upon unreviewed and unproven crap. But it always boils down to this: everyone needs to start buying this product instead of that one.

In the end, all of it is about money and power.

So, logically speaking, if scientists on the one side of this topic are being paid to bend the truth scientists on the other side are likely doing the same. So how does one make an informed decision on this?

[theengel]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

So, logically speaking, if scientists on the one side of this topic are being paid to bend the truth scientists on the other side are likely doing the same. So how does one make an informed decision on this?

Not so. Scientists who offer a difference of opinion or a difference in findings on 'climate change' are ostracized. No one's paying them to do it. The ones who speak up are risking their own necks because they believe we should stick to the truth.

I don't really know how to come up with definitive answers. I just know that the environmental movement itself is powered by money... and that always makes me suspicious. I also know that those who disagree with the current flow are smacked down--not by showing evidence, but by intimidation. Again--this raises enough red flags, in my opinion, to give more credence to some claims than to others.

[rthonpm]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

I just know that the environmental movement itself is powered by money... and that always makes me suspicious.

And many of the researchers who counter the theory are funded by petrochemical companies, so that makes me suspicious.
Not all science has been bought and paid for, and it's a weak argument that 'these guys need to find a way to keep their jobs, so they come up with global warming' since there will always be a need for scientists and researchers since there's always more to learn.

I'm in my mid-forties, I remember acid rain as a big issue in parts of Western Pennsylvania, Maryland, and West Virginia back in the 1980's. The power and manufacturing companies screamed bloody murder that changing the regulations would kill them, but once the changes went into effect, acid rain started becoming less of an issue because with less SO₂ and NO_x floating around in the air, you don't get the chemical reaction that gives you acid rain.

There always seem to be two arguments against anything:

The cigarette argument, where you try to disprove research by casting doubt on it either through your own research, or trying to cast doubt on the motives of those presenting the findings. Tobacco companies did this for years, until their own records showed that they knew full well what cigarettes contribute to cancer.

The seat-belt argument: Henry Ford II claimed that mandating seat-belts would put the car manufacturers out of business, and that cars would become too expensive and people wouldn't want them. Business has used a variation of this excuse for almost everything, and it never pans out like they claim: I still see Fords being produced today.

When it comes to anything regarding science, I go back to what I learned in sixth grade science: good research withstands peer review, allows for the duplication of its results, and doesn't rely on circular references (i.e. Author A cites Author B, who uses Author A's previous work as his main source which cited Author B's previous work as its main source).

I still go back to my first point in my original post in this thread: you can't just pump garbage into the air and not think it won't have some kind of effect. After all, you wouldn't just throw your garbage into your front lawn and eventually not expect bad things to happen would you?

[SalesServiceGuy]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Within one week of Hurricane Harvey being the most destructive hurricane in US history, Hurricane Irma will strike the Carribnean islands and Florida with 185 mph winds making it one of the most powerful Atlantic storms ever recorded.

You do not have to be a scientist to watch global warming and its effects upon the ocean unfolding in front of your eyes.

[Mint325]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Over population can be a factor.

[gneebore]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Don't get me wrong. I despise the industrial pollution that's happening. As much as I love capitalism, I realize something has to be done. And I understand that the only reason America is so clean is because we've outsourced all the dirty work to places where there aren't as many regulations... as well as slave labor.

But man made climate change? That's just stretching things.

You got that right. I moved here in the mid 70's. Back then during rush hour you could actually see the exhaust smoke over the interstate during rush hour. Now if you see a car on the road blowing smoke you know there is a real expensive repair needed. But they are few and far between. There is also a paper mill near here. Back then on a bad day you could smell the output of the plants smokestacks. Now the area around there the place is being developed with housing and more businesses.

Of course I have seen online even before Irma the global warming fanatics pointing to just Harvey as proof of global warming. But the fact there were no major storms to hit the east since Andrew is dismissed or glossed over. The storms have only been named for about 70 years. And the strength of hurricanes has only been accurately recorded since 1943 when hurricane hunters were first formed. There are estimated storm strengths of the ones that hit before that. There is even one that actually caused an estimated 8000 deaths when it hit Galveston Texas, in 1900.

Oh yes and then there is the global warming effect that caused all those hurricanes to strike the US in recent years. Sorry according the NOAA the last one prior to this year was in 2005. Don't believe me here is the map and named storms from NOAA. But then global warming has only taken place in the last year if you accept that strong hurricanes are caused by it.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/de/Hurr-uslandfalling-1950-2007.jpg

[gneebore]

Re: Do you believe that Climate Change is real and caused by mankind?

Not so. Scientists who offer a difference of opinion or a difference in findings on 'climate change' are ostracized. No one's paying them to do it. The ones who speak up are risking their own necks because they believe we should stick to the truth.

I don't really know how to come up with definitive answers. I just know that the environmental movement itself is powered by money... and that always makes me suspicious. I also know that those who disagree with the current flow are smacked down--not by showing evidence, but by intimidation. Again--this raises enough red flags, in my opinion, to give more credence to some claims than to others.

The global warming freaks are quite willing to cause anyone that disagrees with the to lose their job like a french weatherman did when he expressed doubt about the science:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/de/Hurr-uslandfalling-1950-2007.jpg

And then here is where the 97 percent of scientist agree nonsense has been debunked.
"Lawrence Solomon, executive director of Energy Probe and author of The Deniers, carefully explains