Starting to lose faith in the Kyocera A3 product line. Anyone else?

[progoffice]

We've been a Copystar/Kyocera dealer for 20 years. Within the last 2-3 years, we've noticed that paper jam calls have spiked significantly on their A3 models. It started with multi-sheet feeding issues, moved to finisher jams and most recently fuser jams/wraps. We sold a lot of new 4 series and 70/80 3 series machines this year (black and color). Within a week or two of install, we're having to go out and address jams on new machines and hear negative comments from customers. The pattern has become so frequent that we are now hesitant to even sell these models anymore. We've had our tech rep in several times and most suggestions are try new paper, adjust margins, rotate paper and replace wiring harnesses - and that we're the only one having the problem. I'm posting to see if we are the only one having the problem? Our sample size is large enough now that we think something is wrong with these machines.

That being said. Can anyone recommend an alternate independent dealer-friendly product line that has reliable A3 models (black and color) that can be monitored with a cloud based program similar to KFS? We're also a Konica Minolta Dealer, but haven't sold much of their stuff since the i-series came out.

Any thoughts or suggestions on this are appreciated!

[Lunatech]

You are not. However most of the issues I've seen on the new stuff have been successfully addressed at this point. At first I was kind of taken aback by the new stuff, just took a little time to figure out the new idiosyncrasies.

[Dark Helmet]

We don't get a ton of paper jam calls but i'd say the new style feed system, PF-7110 / PF-7150 is very temperamental when it comes to crap paper. We have a ton of schools with the large capacity trays and if that paper is not loaded perfect they will fight you. Curl downwards actually appears to be worse than curl upwards. Ive ripped tray 2 out and watched it feed from tray 4 and when the paper is curled down it grabs on the guides as it's lifted into the feed system.

I find fanning the paper helps a ton. See video:

[ntbann]

We have been using the felt side of industrial Velcro to put on the sides of the LCC lift plates to raise the corners of the paper so they dont flip the corners.

[tmaged]

We have been using the felt side of industrial Velcro to put on the sides of the LCC lift plates to raise the corners of the paper so they dont flip the corners.

I'd be interested in pics if you have any. I've seen some folded/crooked pages on the 4 series.

[CoreyAbels]

Your criticism is warranted, however it has been my experience that with the increase in jams there has been a solid decrease in paper quality. As was noted before, the tandem trays REALLY struggle pushing crap paper from tray 4 into the feed path. My biggest criticism is the poor PWB quality in the new machines. We have had to replace multiple ISU units just in the last few weeks and we RARELY see ISU problems and in addition, the faulty Engine PWBs we have seen are disappointing, to say the least. Just my 2 🪙🪙

[ntbann]

I'd be interested in pics if you have any. I've seen some folded/crooked pages on the 4 series.

Here you go. Im pointing to the pad we put in.

[Dark Helmet]

So is the felt just raising the lead edge of the paper up a few MM which makes it not catch? Thanks for sharing!

[progoffice]

I'm totally on board with paper being part of the problem, but Kyocera's A3 machines act like a car that requires premium fuel to run properly. We analyzed jam histories across all of our Kyocera A3 equipment and found that over 60 of them were jamming every 1,500 pages or less (excluding doc feed jams). Most of these were 4 series machines and among the most common jam codes were 6301, 6110, 4213. For now, we're just trying to sell these on copier stands without finishers to minimize jam calls.

[Lunatech]

This looks like a solid idea. I will try it. Thanks!

[Ropariva]

I'm totally on board with paper being part of the problem, but Kyocera's A3 machines act like a car that requires premium fuel to run properly. We analyzed jam histories across all of our Kyocera A3 equipment and found that over 60 of them were jamming every 1,500 pages or less (excluding doc feed jams). Most of these were 4 series machines and among the most common jam codes were 6301, 6110, 4213. For now, we're just trying to sell these on copier stands without finishers to minimize jam calls.

I don’t think we have run up a new KYOCERA yet that has the lead edge void adjusted correctly. This is key for preventing fuser wraps. The only adjustment for this for printing is U034, LSU out left. Don’t use the test print option provided under this code. It is useless and will ensure it isn’t adjusted correctly. Create your own chart, a PDF with a solid edge all around. Print this from a usb and check the void at the front and the rear. Typically there will be 2.5-3mm lead edge and 4-5mm on the trail edge. This is why you get fuser wraps on solid image prints. I find I normally have to adjust U034 to somewhere between 0.6 and 1.5 on all sources to give an even void on lead and trail edges. Once adjusted come out of maintenance mode and test again with the PDF on your usb key. Get this adjustment right and you will prevent a whole heap of problems. Unfortunately this isn’t a code that can be accessed through KFS so requires a site visit. We have cut our fuser wrap rate to zero now all our field machines are run up correctly and this code is adjusted.

[Lunatech]

I don’t think we have run up a new KYOCERA yet that has the lead edge void adjusted correctly. This is key for preventing fuser wraps. The only adjustment for this for printing is U034, LSU out left. Don’t use the test print option provided under this code. It is useless and will ensure it isn’t adjusted correctly. Create your own chart, a PDF with a solid edge all around. Print this from a usb and check the void at the front and the rear. Typically there will be 2.5-3mm lead edge and 4-5mm on the trail edge. This is why you get fuser wraps on solid image prints. I find I normally have to adjust U034 to somewhere between 0.6 and 1.5 on all sources to give an even void on lead and trail edges. Once adjusted come out of maintenance mode and test again with the PDF on your usb key. Get this adjustment right and you will prevent a whole heap of problems. Unfortunately this isn’t a code that can be accessed through KFS so requires a site visit. We have cut our fuser wrap rate to zero now all our field machines are run up correctly and this code is adjusted.

I agree most come out of the box needing adjustment. It is important to do this or you will likely have issues. It seems a tech with some experience knows this. What I did not know for a little while was that when you make adjustments to U402 for print margin an application or print driver can over ride it and cut the margin down to nil, causing me huge issues. I don't understand why this service mode exists if it can simply be nullified. A proper print driver (KX) will not affect it, however an application may have free range to mess up your day. This is sort of a machine issue and sort of not.

I have often thought the settings were so far off because of some weird dynamic caused from being designed and tested with A4 sized paper, however it sounds like it is the same for A4 users.

[progoffice]

Do these adjustments also help with finisher jams? Two calls up right now for 6110 finisher jams, both on 4054ci machines. One is a recall from yesterday where I had to remove the mysterious yet common half folded sheet that gets trapped in the "mouth" of the finisher before the exit tray.

[nathicana]

Love the serviceability and print quality on the newer midsize Kyoceras but they have a few shortcomings.

I agree with Progoffice that they fail to feed paper reliably (05xx jams: no feed or multi feed from drawers). Maybe premium paper helps but you shouldn't need it, other brands usually don't. The Finishers are great when they are working but too many jams: 6510 and 6511 (even with new style bundle eject sensor). Also a rash of 6301, 6311 and more

DP-7160 really impresses with its speed. But too much skewing even when following bulletin M105. I've tried turning on Device settings/Original scan settings/Prevent original skewing. If anyone knows what that setting does in detail I'm interested. The fact that it is an optional setting makes me wonder if there is a drawback in performance.

[BBM]

Here you go. Im pointing to the pad we put in.

Thanks for this tip . Trying it on one today thats been having that issue .