What happens to the developer?

[mihailelea]

Hi!
I'm in the business of refurbishing second hand printers and selling them.
I had little experience so far with Konica Minolta, I was more a HP fan, but I've started to bring Konica Minolta's in my shop recently.
Basically I want to sell them with 100% toner, 100% developer, 100% fusing unit, 100% transfer belt etc.
I have no problem replacing the toner, fuser, belt etc..., but my question is:
If I buy new developer (in a bag, not developing unit), can I save the old developer that is still left in the developing unit and reuse it in another printer?
I have 2 copiers that came with 60%, 70% developer. Can I pour the 60% developer from the first copier in the developing unit of the second copier?
So, what happens to the developer over time? Does it consumes like the toner, or does it have some properties that diminish with a no. of prints?
I hope I don't offend anyone with my noob question...
Thank's in advance!

[copyman]

Re: What happens to the developer?

I would not reuse the developer. I sell a lot of Kon/Min off lease machines. I sell with full toners but if other consumables are over 50% (usually are over 50% because I only buy low meter machines) I sell the machines without replacing any of the consumables. Before selling I make sure to turn off the warnings for the consumables. They can run way past their life with no quality drop off. By the time you replace all the consumables your profit is gone!

[luca72]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Hi!
I'm in the business of refurbishing second hand printers and selling them.
I had little experience so far with Konica Minolta, I was more a HP fan, but I've started to bring Konica Minolta's in my shop recently.
Basically I want to sell them with 100% toner, 100% developer, 100% fusing unit, 100% transfer belt etc.
I have no problem replacing the toner, fuser, belt etc..., but my question is:
If I buy new developer (in a bag, not developing unit), can I save the old developer that is still left in the developing unit and reuse it in another printer?
I have 2 copiers that came with 60%, 70% developer. Can I pour the 60% developer from the first copier in the developing unit of the second copier?
So, what happens to the developer over time? Does it consumes like the toner, or does it have some properties that diminish with a no. of prints?
I hope I don't offend anyone with my noob question...
Thank's in advance!

hello, I think it's never a good idea to reuse one machine's developers in another, partly because sometimes the groups already have problems and their defects, you risk to go against strange error codes and copy quality problems, moreover sometimes the developer lasts less than established ... the starting point is a new developer, as well as the whole new unit, good work

[blackcat4866]

Re: What happens to the developer?

The ferrite particles have a resin coating on them, to create the tribo-electric effect (static electricity). As that resin wears off it produces less tribo-electric effect, eventually leaving some of that developer on the paper, into the drum cleaner and waste bottle, and into the bottom of the machine. Most modern machines have supplemental ferrite in the toner cartridge to help extend the life of the developer. At some point though the developer will be leaving the machine much faster than it's entering. Typically the machine will add too much toner and you'll start to see background or toner dumping on the paper, but it may undertone instead, going faint. By the time you notice overtoning or undertoning it's pretty advanced, and it's time to change out that developer.

Most modern machines do not sell developer separately from the developing unit, making your question a moot point.

Assuming you could collect this used developer, how would you know the current toner density of the developer you removed? And how would you know how much has been lost/depleted? I do know techs that use precision scales to weigh a new developing unit, then fill the used developing unit to the same weight, but that doesn't answer the first question.

After all that I'll just say, don't do it. You'll create difficult to diagnose problems for yourself. =^..^=

[mihailelea]

Re: What happens to the developer?

The ferrite particles have a resin coating on them, to create the tribo-electric effect (static electricity). As that resin wears off it produces less tribo-electric effect, eventually leaving some of that developer on the paper, into the drum cleaner and waste bottle, and into the bottom of the machine. Most modern machines have supplemental ferrite in the toner cartridge to help extend the life of the developer. At some point though the developer will be leaving the machine much faster than it's entering. Typically the machine will add too much toner and you'll start to see background or toner dumping on the paper, but it may undertone instead, going faint. By the time you notice overtoning or undertoning it's pretty advanced, and it's time to change out that developer.

Most modern machines do not sell developer separately from the developing unit, making your question a moot point.

Assuming you could collect this used developer, how would you know the current toner density of the developer you removed? And how would you know how much has been lost/depleted? I do know techs that use precision scales to weigh a new developing unit, then fill the used developing unit to the same weight, but that doesn't answer the first question.

After all that I'll just say, don't do it. You'll create difficult to diagnose problems for yourself. =^..^=

Thank you!
I believe this is the answer I was waiting for.
Now I understand why I should't do it, and I definitely won't.
Thank's again!

[copyman]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Great explanation BC of the science with developers, toners. I think the original poster was talking about a bag of aftermarket developer which is being sold now. I tried the kon/min "4" series aftermarket developer but didn't work well.

[blackcat4866]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Back in my Canon/Ricoh days my employer for a while used Katun developer and toner. The idea was that since Katun designed both parts they should be well suited to each other. In practical application though Ricohs dump Katun toner just as effectively as Ricoh toner. =^..^=

[copyman]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Yep, I remember those old Ricoh's with aftermarket toner. I recall a lot of overtoning. Personally back then with analog Ricoh's I never liked the toner add system. ID sensor reading a patch, etc. I hated those toner pigs! Vac every call !!!

[antone]

Re: What happens to the developer?

No you can't ..sorry
.


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[yianni]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Just for my curiosity, for which modes are you interested for? I suppose for desktop KM machines, I'm correct?

> I have 2 copiers that came with 60%, 70% developer. Can I pour the 60% developer from the first copier in
> the developing unit of the second copier?

70% means that the developer unit worked 30% of its life. It may contains 100% of the developer powder.

[copyman]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Yanni is right. Developer is not "consumed", it just "carries" the toner. The consumable life % doesn't mean the developer was removed from dev unit it just means that's how much it's carried the toner in it.

[Synthohol]

Re: What happens to the developer?

you are seeing the % of life left on the DV units themselves.

[blackcat4866]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Just for my curiosity, for which modes are you interested for? I suppose for desktop KM machines, I'm correct?

> I have 2 copiers that came with 60%, 70% developer. Can I pour the 60% developer from the first copier in
> the developing unit of the second copier?

70% means that the developer unit worked 30% of its life. It may contains 100% of the developer powder.

Exactly how will you determine the toner density, and or the proper quantity of developer? =^..^=

[AjitN]

Re: What happens to the developer?

Great explanation BC of the science with developers, toners. I think the original poster was talking about a bag of aftermarket developer which is being sold now. I tried the kon/min "4" series aftermarket developer but didn't work well.

I am using C8000 developers in low speed machines, cheap but ORIGINAL option, & works very much fine.

[Boltaction]

Re: What happens to the developer?

I would not reuse the developer. I sell a lot of Kon/Min off lease machines. I sell with full toners but if other consumables are over 50% (usually are over 50% because I only buy low meter machines) I sell the machines without replacing any of the consumables. Before selling I make sure to turn off the warnings for the consumables. They can run way past their life with no quality drop off. By the time you replace all the consumables your profit is gone!

In my experience, as I have a lot of these machines in the field, running drums past life is fine but if they go too far they will begin to deplete developer prematurely. We used to set the machines up in the shop with all consumable reminders off until we started to notice c-255x codes relating to undertonned/overtonned developer units, to which the only cure is replacing an $800 developer unit (sometimes multiple). Because the genuine Konica Minolta drum units run for so long before showing lines/streaking, the risk of the drums zapping developer units increase. We have since turned the drum reminder on at the expense of maintenance customers calling for us to replace the drum units.