Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

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  • 907tec
    Trusted Tech
    250+ Posts
    • Feb 2008
    • 438

    Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

    OK. I've got a weird one for y'all: orange toner.

    Back story: A few years back, I received a service call for a C454 located at a remote mine. During troubleshooting for some minor issue (jamming I think?), I had them send me some photos of the machine. In these photos, I could see very clearly that there was orange toner scattered around the K toner cartridge slot. orange toner scattered around the K toner cartridge slot. Not yellow, not a waste-toner mix, but actually orange.

    The machine is a real pain to get to, and I was able to resolve the jamming issues remotely, so I didn't think too long about it. Fast forward 2-3 years, and I am out visiting the same mine working on a different machine that is located on the opposite side of the building. This one is a C554e. Imagine my shock when I open the toner door and see ORANGE TONER scattered only around the K toner slot. Normal amounts of CMY toner scattered in front of those slots, but distinctly orange toner around the K.

    PXL_20240220_170958017.MP.jpg

    I've been wrenching on these things for nearly 20 years, only two times I've encountered this have been in this one building. It is the mill at an underground metals mine, so there is definitely a smell/taste to the air inside.

    Is it possible that there is something in the air that is reacting with the toner and turning it orange? Maybe oxidizing the ferrite particles rapidly? It hasn't really been an issue yet, but it is perplexing me.
  • Markks
    Trusted Tech
    Site Contributor
    250+ Posts
    • Feb 2018
    • 412

    #2
    Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

    Originally posted by 907tec
    OK. I've got a weird one for y'all: orange toner.

    Back story: A few years back, I received a service call for a C454 located at a remote mine. During troubleshooting for some minor issue (jamming I think?), I had them send me some photos of the machine. In these photos, I could see very clearly that there was orange toner scattered around the K toner cartridge slot. orange toner scattered around the K toner cartridge slot. Not yellow, not a waste-toner mix, but actually orange.

    The machine is a real pain to get to, and I was able to resolve the jamming issues remotely, so I didn't think too long about it. Fast forward 2-3 years, and I am out visiting the same mine working on a different machine that is located on the opposite side of the building. This one is a C554e. Imagine my shock when I open the toner door and see ORANGE TONER scattered only around the K toner slot. Normal amounts of CMY toner scattered in front of those slots, but distinctly orange toner around the K.

    [ATTACH=CONFIG]61704[/ATTACH]

    I've been wrenching on these things for nearly 20 years, only two times I've encountered this have been in this one building. It is the mill at an underground metals mine, so there is definitely a smell/taste to the air inside.

    Is it possible that there is something in the air that is reacting with the toner and turning it orange? Maybe oxidizing the ferrite particles rapidly? It hasn't really been an issue yet, but it is perplexing me.
    I think you are correct that something in the air of the mine is reacting with the toner causing it to turn orange

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    • blackcat4866
      Master Of The Obvious
      Site Contributor
      10,000+ Posts
      • Jul 2007
      • 22542

      #3
      Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

      It's not the typical canary yellow, but still maybe sunflower yellow? I suspect that it's generic toner, slightly off color. =^..^=
      If you'd like a serious answer to your request:
      1) demonstrate that you've read the manual
      2) demonstrate that you made some attempt to fix it.
      3) if you're going to ask about jams include the jam code.
      4) if you're going to ask about an error code include the error code.
      5) You are the person onsite. Only you can make observations.

      blackcat: Master Of The Obvious =^..^=

      Comment

      • tsbservice
        Field tech
        Site Contributor
        5,000+ Posts
        • May 2007
        • 7387

        #4
        Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

        I would say developer in K toner bottle is rusting, others CMY too but it's hard to see in them.
        A tree is known by its fruit, a man by his deeds. A good deed is never lost, he who sows courtesy, reaps friendship, and he who plants kindness gathers love.
        Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused.

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        • 907tec
          Trusted Tech
          250+ Posts
          • Feb 2008
          • 438

          #5
          Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

          Originally posted by blackcat4866
          It's not the typical canary yellow, but still maybe sunflower yellow? I suspect that it's generic toner, slightly off color. =^..^=
          They're on contract, all toner is included so I hope they aren't buying generic. Bottles in the machine appear to be genuine and I haven't seen any evidence that they are using generics. It IS a mine, so I would not be surprised at all to find out that these knuckleheads have messed with the machine in some way. But... Sourcing generic toner with their requesition process seems difficult, at best.

          Comment

          • copier tech
            Field Supervisor
            5,000+ Posts
            • Jan 2014
            • 7727

            #6
            Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

            Could be that in the past they've fitted a yellow toner in the black slot, so that orange is a mix of black / yellow, but you say no issues with print quality!?

            Comment

            • femaster
              Service Manager
              1,000+ Posts
              • May 2011
              • 1323

              #7
              Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

              Originally posted by tsbservice
              I would say developer in K toner bottle is rusting, others CMY too but it's hard to see in them.
              That was my first thought as well.
              A Ricoh Service Tech for 7 year. A Konica Minolta Service Tech for 7 years. Now, KM service manager for 4 years.
              My Ricoh knowledge is slowly dwindling away at this point. Many things have been lost to time...

              Comment

              • Larhal
                Official Old Fart
                Site Contributor
                250+ Posts
                • May 2013
                • 297

                #8
                Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                If the K developer was rusting it would cause CQ issues long before that light dusting shows due to the resistivity of the carrier particles. I noticed the C toner was dusting also. I has to do with the Y and M toner dusting in that environment as they are prior to the K toner area. Has to be the environment that the unit is in.

                If you ever noticed the K drum and dev units get covered in a dusting of Y, C,M toner in many different machines?
                Larhal

                Part time retired. OK more retired than part time.

                If all else fails read the Service Manual!

                If that fails, meet me at the pub and we will discuss it, maybe, probably not we are at the pub!

                Comment

                • dalewb74
                  Senior Tech
                  Site Contributor
                  500+ Posts
                  • Feb 2018
                  • 985

                  #9
                  Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                  hopefully there are no oompa loompas in the mine. sorry just couldn't resist......

                  Comment

                  • 907tec
                    Trusted Tech
                    250+ Posts
                    • Feb 2008
                    • 438

                    #10
                    Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                    Originally posted by Larhal
                    If the K developer was rusting it would cause CQ issues long before that light dusting shows due to the resistivity of the carrier particles. I noticed the C toner was dusting also. I has to do with the Y and M toner dusting in that environment as they are prior to the K toner area. Has to be the environment that the unit is in.

                    If you ever noticed the K drum and dev units get covered in a dusting of Y, C,M toner in many different machines?

                    No copy quality issues on these machines that I have seen. Normal amounts of toner scattered around each of the drum areas, certainly nothing like I've seen on other 4-series when the cyan contaminates the K drum.

                    I agree that if the K dev was rusting in the tank it would cause all sorts of issues, but it appears as though the 'orange' reaction is only occurring on loose toner that is exposed to the environment for long periods of time. Like the spilled toner on the inside surface of the door will have more exposure to the elements than toner inside of a bottle/tank/etc that is constantly replenished and agitated. That's the best theory I've got, at least. Very open to hearing other takes on this.

                    Comment

                    • allan
                      RTFM!!
                      5,000+ Posts
                      • Apr 2010
                      • 5402

                      #11
                      Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                      Is developer not rust already?
                      Can Fe3O4(black) turn to Fe2O3(red) I am no chemist but isn't that called reduction not oxidation?
                      Whatever

                      Comment

                      • allan
                        RTFM!!
                        5,000+ Posts
                        • Apr 2010
                        • 5402

                        #12
                        Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                        Originally posted by allan
                        Is developer not rust already?
                        Can Fe3O4(black) turn to Fe2O3(red) I am no chemist but isn't that called reduction not oxidation?
                        Yea I am wrong black rust is lighter than red rust so yes oxidation will turn black rust into red rust. I can still be wrong. You will need a lot of heat to go from red to black. Could then just need oxygen and water to go from black to red. Use to make black rust by burning red rust with a cutting torch to make a better burning thermite. Wonder how that will happen in that environment. But that is developer not toner.

                        Then there is this stuff - Yellow Rust. Iron oxide-hydroxide FeO(OH)H2O
                        Whatever

                        Comment

                        • judgedredd
                          Technician
                          • Feb 2024
                          • 38

                          #13
                          Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                          What type of mine is it?

                          Comment

                          • Larhal
                            Official Old Fart
                            Site Contributor
                            250+ Posts
                            • May 2013
                            • 297

                            #14
                            Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                            Originally posted by 907tec
                            No copy quality issues on these machines that I have seen. Normal amounts of toner scattered around each of the drum areas, certainly nothing like I've seen on other 4-series when the cyan contaminates the K drum.

                            I agree that if the K dev was rusting in the tank it would cause all sorts of issues, but it appears as though the 'orange' reaction is only occurring on loose toner that is exposed to the environment for long periods of time. Like the spilled toner on the inside surface of the door will have more exposure to the elements than toner inside of a bottle/tank/etc that is constantly replenished and agitated. That's the best theory I've got, at least. Very open to hearing other takes on this.

                            One thing is that Toner itself is a inert plastic powder How would plastic react with something else. Yes there is surface treatments on the toner for flow and cleaning aids, etc. Just curious of the environment they are in.
                            Larhal

                            Part time retired. OK more retired than part time.

                            If all else fails read the Service Manual!

                            If that fails, meet me at the pub and we will discuss it, maybe, probably not we are at the pub!

                            Comment

                            • Saturn
                              Trusted Tech
                              Site Contributor
                              100+ Posts
                              • Nov 2023
                              • 115

                              #15
                              Re: Why do 2 of my machines have ORANGE toner?

                              Never seen orange Toners. If this exist, it would be nice for all the Dutch people Could it be an early April Fool's joke?
                              I don't care about who your father is, as long as I'm fishing here, you won't walk on water.

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