indentured servants my ass.....

[Akitu]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

I have not been able to find any article with actual observed evolution that produces a new species. Even the bacteria example isn't evolution. The bacteria is still a bacteria, it is just resistant.

Cross breeding creatures like llamas and camels, or lions and tigers to create a new sub species is the first step to a new species.

[Darren King]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

Cross breeding creatures like llamas and camels, or lions and tigers to create a new sub species is the first step to a new species.

True, but that is not evolution. That is genetic modification. Evolution by definition is spontaneous change of one species into another. Not interbreeding.

[ZOOTECH]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

True, but that is not evolution. That is genetic modification. Evolution by definition is spontaneous change of one species into another. Not interbreeding.

"Spontaneous change"? What source are you using for that definition?

[Akitu]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

True, but that is not evolution. That is genetic modification. Evolution by definition is spontaneous change of one species into another. Not interbreeding.

According to the Mirriam-Webster dictionary, evolution by definition is as follows.

1
: one of a set of prescribed movements

2
a : a process of change in a certain direction : unfolding
b : the action or an instance of forming and giving something off : emission
c (1) : a process of continuous change from a lower, simpler, or worse to a higher, more complex, or better state : growth(2) : a process of gradual and relatively peaceful social, political, and economic advance
d : something evolved

3
: the process of working out or developing

4
a : the historical development of a biological group (as a race or species) : phylogeny
b : a theory that the various types of animals and plants have their origin in other preexisting types and that the distinguishable differences are due to modifications in successive generations; also : the process described by this theory

5
: the extraction of a mathematical root

6
: a process in which the whole universe is a progression of interrelated phenomena


So, looking at all the given definitions, we can see by context that 4 B is our relevant definition of evolution. It says nothing about creating a whole new species from nothing.

A simplified version of what that definition is stating
a theory that the various kinds of plants and animals are descended from other kinds that lived in earlier times and that the differences are due to inherited changes that took place over many generations.

"Spontaneous change"? What source are you using for that definition?

Not sure, here's the proper definition.

Honestly, the day some new creature randomly pops out of a baboon's ass hole is the day I get on my knees, kiss the dirt and start worshiping my invisible friend.

[Darren King]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

"Spontaneous change"? What source are you using for that definition?

Sorry, it is caused by changes in the environment. For example, if I was an early giraffe with a short neck and the trees started getting taller, evolution says that my neck grew longer so I could still eat. Hmmm. Sounds kinda silly when you say it out loud. lol.

[Darren King]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

According to the Mirriam-Webster dictionary, evolution by definition is as follows.

1
: one of a set of prescribed movements

2
a : a process of change in a certain direction : unfolding
b : the action or an instance of forming and giving something off : emission
c (1) : a process of continuous change from a lower, simpler, or worse to a higher, more complex, or better state : growth(2) : a process of gradual and relatively peaceful social, political, and economic advance
d : something evolved

3
: the process of working out or developing

4
a : the historical development of a biological group (as a race or species) : phylogeny
b : a theory that the various types of animals and plants have their origin in other preexisting types and that the distinguishable differences are due to modifications in successive generations; also : the process described by this theory

5
: the extraction of a mathematical root

6
: a process in which the whole universe is a progression of interrelated phenomena


So, looking at all the given definitions, we can see by context that 4 B is our relevant definition of evolution. It says nothing about creating a whole new species from nothing.

A simplified version of what that definition is stating
a theory that the various kinds of plants and animals are descended from other kinds that lived in earlier times and that the differences are due to inherited changes that took place over many generations.



Not sure, here's the proper definition.

Honestly, the day some new creature randomly pops out of a baboon's ass hole is the day I get on my knees, kiss the dirt and start worshiping my invisible friend.

I didn't say a species came from nothing.

[Akitu]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

I didn't say a species came from nothing.

You said "spontaneous".

1
: proceeding from natural feeling or native tendency without external constraint

2
: arising from a momentary impulse

3
: controlled and directed internally : self-acting<spontaneous movement characteristic of living things>

4
: produced without being planted or without human labor :indigenous

5
: developing or occurring without apparent external influence, force, cause, or treatment

6
: not apparently contrived or manipulated : natural

My apologies for applying the wrong definition of the word.

[Darren King]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

You said "spontaneous".

1
: proceeding from natural feeling or native tendency without external constraint

2
: arising from a momentary impulse

3
: controlled and directed internally : self-acting<spontaneous movement characteristic of living things>

4
: produced without being planted or without human labor :indigenous

5
: developing or occurring without apparent external influence, force, cause, or treatment

6
: not apparently contrived or manipulated : natural

My apologies for applying the wrong definition of the word.

I may have used the wrong word. No, I definitely used the wrong word, as you have so eloquently pointed out. Damn you. lol

[DAG COPIERS & COMPUTERS]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

"Spontaneous change"? What source are you using for that definition?

Darren King's definition of evolution as a ''Spontaneous'' change is very correct!
- According to 'OXFORD ADVANCED LEARNER'S DICTIONARY', 7th edition published by the Oxford University press in 2007, the word 'spontaneous is defined thus or has the following meanings:

1- Not planned but done because you want to do it.
2- Doing things without planning, because you suddenly want to do them.
3- (TECHNICAL)- Happening NATURALLY, without being made to happen.
4- Done NATURALLY, without being forced or practiced.

So you can see that from definition 3 & 4 above, Evolution is really a ''Spontaneous'' process. While cross-breeding is indeed ''Genetic modification''.
But one thing we must bear in mind is that behind this genetic modification there is Intelligent humans who thought of doing & making it happen, and for a purpose. Just as there's an super human intelligence or supreme intelligence...call 'Him' God, if you want, behind that spontaneous evolution.

[DAG COPIERS & COMPUTERS]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

I may have used the wrong word. No, I definitely used the wrong word, as you have so eloquently pointed out. Damn you. lol

No Sir, you didn't use the wrong word in the wrong place at the wrong time. You application of the word fits perfectly well in the context of the discussion.
The word 'NATURAL' means ''Existing in nature; not made or caused by humans. And that is what evolution is, its assumed to be a natural process, not man made.
- For this reason we can also say that the ''peppered moth'' in London changing its color from white to black due to EXTERNAL FACTOR of industrial pollution..(.i.e man made factor) was NOT Evolution but simply 'unknowingly' a 'Genetic modification' caused by industrial pollution, as a result of man's activity.
- We can here, reasonably say that man was trying to 'cheat' nature, BUT nature 'kept its truth, which later 'prevailed and the peppered moths starting to regain their 'lost' color WHITE, as soon as man stopped or reduced interfering with its environment.

[DAG COPIERS & COMPUTERS]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

I just found this and thought it was relevant...


Penn Jillette's 10 Commandments for atheists



1. The highest ideals are human intelligence, creativity and love. Respect these above all.
2. Do not put things or even ideas above other human beings. (Let's scream at each other about Kindle versus iPad, solar versus nuclear, Republican versus Libertarian, Garth Brooks versus Sun Ra
3. Say what you mean, even when talking to yourself. (What used to be an oath to (G)od is now quite simply respecting yourself.)
4. Put aside some time to rest and think. (If you're religious, that might be the Sabbath; if you're a Vegas magician, that'll be the day with the lowest grosses.)
5. Be there for your family. Love your parents, your partner, and your children. (Love is deeper than honor, and parents matter, but so do spouse and children.)
6. Respect and protect all human life. (Many believe that "Thou shalt not kill" only refers to people in the same tribe. I say it's all human life.)
7. Keep your promises. (If you can't be sexually exclusive to your spouse, don't make that deal.)

9. Don't lie. (You know, unless you're doing magic tricks and it's part of your job. Does that make it OK for politicians, too?)
10. Don't waste too much time wishing, hoping, and being envious; it'll make you bugnutty.

I must say thank you once again for this particular post. I can also say, ''Now you are Talking". If you can recall, in my earlier posts I had requested if you could 'avail' for us some literature or some form of atheist 'Bible'. Now I can see that you are posting some of the 'books' written by atheists or on Atheism.
- Having said that, let me add here that I really see nothing new in the 10 commandments of Atheist as posted above. I can only see it as a ''VERSION''...Translated from the original "TEXT" ...which is God's 10 Commandments as given to Moses. OR a VARIANT of the famous code of Hammurabi.
- Jesus summarized all these 10 ten commandments into two:
1- Knowing and Loving God, the only one, with all your mind, body and soul.
2- Love your neighbor as you Love yourself.
' There is no any other commandment greater than this', concluded Jesus.
And its true, LOVE surpasses everything.

[fixthecopier]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

Evolution is one thing. But when there is no life at all like at the beginning of time. ? How did we start? Even Darwin said there had to be something to start the SPARK of life. He did believe there was a god.

This is to complicated of a subject. And you will never convince people one way or the other. So I try to stay off the subject.

Fixthecopier dude. Forgive me getting off your subject here. If you like Penn Jillette then see what he has to say about the 2A.

A well regulated Militia, being neceray to the security of a free state, ( see that last comma ) the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

He talks about the comma being a pause and clumsy. The only place out of the entire Constitution where these old hack framers of our country FUCKED it up. His words. He is using Sacasm with that staement.

I really like the guy.

Mr. Bill, first of all, it seems as though you may have not understood my positions on the second amendment. I am pretty much with you. I own guns, daddy took me hunting when I was a boy and I have no problem with deer meat. If I seemed to get short with you in the other thread, my apologies. What fires me up are the nuts. The ones who for some reason feel that there should be no background checks or need fro gun permits of any kind. Sorry, but I do not want the guy who just got out of jail or the mental hospital buying handguns. I don't mind a 3 day waiting period because if you got to have a pistol right now, we got a problem.

That whole idea that people should be able to equip themselves just like the army, well that just is never going to happen. That whole notion of some guys forming a local militia that will fight off a tyrannical government, is simply ludicrous in this day and age. If the government ever shows up at your home and wants what you have, they will get it if they are using force. Whenever I have seen these clips of say about a dozen guys out in the woods somewhere playing army and marching with guns to practice for when society collapses, I hope they are smart enough to put down their weapons and live another day, when the army shows up. I base this on a short clip i watched on base about 7 years ago. A Special Forces A Team, in 2 armored heavy trucks, leveled a small town filled with armed insurgents in about 45 seconds. Nothing was left. It was not training, it was a real.

If so many people are always concerned about how our government behaves, then why do we not make our children learn how the political system works and encourage everyone to vote. Well my opinion is that those who control both sides of politics find it easier to control people with sound bites and one liners, because as Dag pointed out earlier , thinking is hard. Why did the republicans try so hard to restrict voting. Because if democracy is applied and everyone votes, they lose.

[DAG COPIERS & COMPUTERS]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

If you would like to challenge my beliefs in evolution, bring some facts and data to the table and lets see what you have.

Thanks for enlightening us on the Religious quote by Karl Marx. As you rightly stated many people do not have a clear meaning of that quote, but now i do know.
- As for the controversial topic of Evolution, I don't think we can exhaustively discuss it in this forum. My personal view is that even the facts and data presently available to the evolutionists do not provide conclusive evidence in support of the theory of evolution. As a member clearly stated in his post on this topic, ''Even Darwin himself believed and said that there must be ''SOMETHING'' to 'originally SPARK' the evolution process. It is this 'original something' that, we want to know! What it is, how it began, how it operates, and Why and when it 'decides' to 'spark' the evolution process.
The scientists working on the hadron collider to recreate the 'Big Bang' condition called this 'original' thing, the 'God Particle'. Describing and adducing the processes which occur during evolution is one thing. Telling us 'who' decides that the process should take place and at what predefined time, or instant, how long it should take and when to stop is another matter altogether.

[DAG COPIERS & COMPUTERS]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

Dear Bill & fixthecopier, This is to remind you that, there's already another thread running on ''Gun Control...'' elsewhere on the forum.
This thread is about 'Indentured servants my ass....' by posting 'gun control' issues here you are likely to derail us from this topic. Please kindly stick to the thread. Thank you.

[fixthecopier]

Re: indentured servants my ass.....

Am I the only one who finds it amusing , or annoying that when the topic of evolution vs creationism comes up, those who believe in God do so based on faith alone and demand that those who believe in evolution must show proof now!

And while I am thinking about it, if anyone ask "If we evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?", I will one day show up where you live and stab you in the eye with a screwdriver.

In the many thousands of years that man has had the curiosity to explore science and critical thinking, all but the last little speck of time has had religion standing over it and holding back science that might conflict with their religious teachings. If you are a man of science 1000 years ago it was kind of hard to get support for your theory that the earth revolves around the sun when the scripture says different. I am well aware of all the scientist who had faith, but that just goes with being alive in those times. When the faith based believers are shown any scientific proof, they tend to dismiss it as not being plausible. This is usually not based on them doing research about the methods that were used to come to what ever conclusion, but the result of that person processing the data through what ever education they were exposed to This is a form of mind control. In America and other places the religious fanatics are messing with our education system ,trying to force the teaching of creationism in an effort to interfere in the critical thinking process. The less they know, the easier they are to control.

I some girl had posted on facebook a picture of a test she took in a class. The question was about calculating the mass of one of the planets. She wrote "Jesus" for the answer and told the teacher that Jesus was the answer for everything. The teacher counted the answer as correct.

The teacher should be reprimanded for cheating the child of education.

The point of the question was teaching how to do basic math, not about how big the planets were.

The child should be embarrassed about being proud about not knowing math.

This is 1 example of why religion should be left out of schools.


Are Scientists Atheists? : Discovery News ...Seems like a lot of scientist are atheist